1
00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:14,910
[Music]

2
00:00:20,630 --> 00:00:17,590
wow

3
00:00:22,870 --> 00:00:20,640
welcome to shattered reality with your

4
00:00:25,750 --> 00:00:22,880
hosts kate valentine

5
00:00:26,630 --> 00:00:25,760
and ferocia prepare to have your

6
00:00:30,230 --> 00:00:26,640
paradigms

7
00:00:33,510 --> 00:00:30,240
shifted into truth questioned

8
00:00:34,870 --> 00:00:33,520
and now shattered reality shattered

9
00:00:42,389 --> 00:00:34,880
reality

10
00:00:46,229 --> 00:00:42,399
um this is ferusha here and today

11
00:00:50,069 --> 00:00:46,239
is march 12 2019

12
00:00:52,310 --> 00:00:50,079
and i am here um again without kate

13
00:00:54,630 --> 00:00:52,320
valentine who really really wants to

14
00:00:57,430 --> 00:00:54,640
come back i just spoke with her

15
00:00:59,189 --> 00:00:57,440
last night and she really can't wait

16
00:01:01,110 --> 00:00:59,199
till she has the opportunity to come

17
00:01:04,549 --> 00:01:01,120
back she has assured me

18
00:01:08,390 --> 00:01:04,559
so it's been a while but i have faith

19
00:01:12,469 --> 00:01:08,400
that she will in indeed return to us

20
00:01:15,670 --> 00:01:12,479
today is our 85th show

21
00:01:18,870 --> 00:01:15,680
and it is going to be

22
00:01:23,270 --> 00:01:18,880
i think a very interesting one

23
00:01:27,030 --> 00:01:23,280
we have somebody here today who

24
00:01:30,870 --> 00:01:27,040
has compiled an enormous number

25
00:01:34,069 --> 00:01:30,880
of case histories he

26
00:01:38,870 --> 00:01:34,079
seems to be something between

27
00:01:42,069 --> 00:01:38,880
an anthropologist and a folklorist

28
00:01:45,030 --> 00:01:42,079
he is just really

29
00:01:45,670 --> 00:01:45,040
interesting in the way that he views

30
00:01:49,670 --> 00:01:45,680
these

31
00:01:54,950 --> 00:01:49,680
uh paranormal experiences of others

32
00:01:58,469 --> 00:01:54,960
so uh without any further edu

33
00:02:00,469 --> 00:01:58,479
uh let me introduce mr mike

34
00:02:01,590 --> 00:02:00,479
clelland am i saying it right it's a cle

35
00:02:03,749 --> 00:02:01,600
lindell clelland

36
00:02:05,670 --> 00:02:03,759
which is perfect the first time okay

37
00:02:08,869 --> 00:02:05,680
good that's what i thought it was

38
00:02:12,949 --> 00:02:08,879
well mike is here because

39
00:02:16,630 --> 00:02:12,959
um he has written uh two books

40
00:02:21,430 --> 00:02:16,640
about paranormal experiences

41
00:02:23,990 --> 00:02:21,440
involving owls and he also has a blog

42
00:02:25,510 --> 00:02:24,000
and um why don't you tell us a little

43
00:02:28,790 --> 00:02:25,520
bit about your

44
00:02:34,309 --> 00:02:28,800
uh background you know your uh

45
00:02:37,350 --> 00:02:34,319
how you got into this field and subject

46
00:02:38,229 --> 00:02:37,360
well i'm i'm 56 now and if we turn the

47
00:02:42,070 --> 00:02:38,239
clock back

48
00:02:44,390 --> 00:02:42,080
uh to 2006 which is now

49
00:02:45,110 --> 00:02:44,400
i think that's like 13 years ago good

50
00:02:47,670 --> 00:02:45,120
grief

51
00:02:49,190 --> 00:02:47,680
um i had an event when i was living out

52
00:02:51,110 --> 00:02:49,200
west in idaho

53
00:02:52,869 --> 00:02:51,120
uh where i saw a bunch of owls that

54
00:02:54,710 --> 00:02:52,879
takes up the first little bit of the

55
00:02:56,150 --> 00:02:54,720
first book and i've repeated that story

56
00:02:58,869 --> 00:02:56,160
many many times

57
00:02:59,990 --> 00:02:58,879
but but what it was was um i don't need

58
00:03:01,110 --> 00:03:00,000
to if you want me to go through the

59
00:03:03,190 --> 00:03:01,120
whole thing i can but i can

60
00:03:04,869 --> 00:03:03,200
just for the intro here i can say that

61
00:03:07,990 --> 00:03:04,879
uh i think that

62
00:03:10,229 --> 00:03:08,000
i think that perhaps many people

63
00:03:12,550 --> 00:03:10,239
have heard that story who might be

64
00:03:15,589 --> 00:03:12,560
listening to shattered reality

65
00:03:17,589 --> 00:03:15,599
so i think that perhaps going over it in

66
00:03:18,309 --> 00:03:17,599
the short run and those who haven't

67
00:03:21,589 --> 00:03:18,319
heard it

68
00:03:23,830 --> 00:03:21,599
can listen or read your blog about it or

69
00:03:26,070 --> 00:03:23,840
buy one of your wonderful books which

70
00:03:29,350 --> 00:03:26,080
you can feel free to mention

71
00:03:30,710 --> 00:03:29,360
perfect perfect so um the short version

72
00:03:35,270 --> 00:03:30,720
is i went camping

73
00:03:38,550 --> 00:03:35,280
with a friend and we saw owls

74
00:03:41,509 --> 00:03:38,560
excuse me we saw owls what

75
00:03:41,910 --> 00:03:41,519
felt like a very unusual circumstance um

76
00:03:48,550 --> 00:03:41,920
and

77
00:03:49,509 --> 00:03:48,560
saw the owls i had a voice in my head

78
00:03:52,710 --> 00:03:49,519
that said

79
00:03:54,149 --> 00:03:52,720
this has something to do with the ufos

80
00:03:55,990 --> 00:03:54,159
and i did not talk about that at the

81
00:03:56,789 --> 00:03:56,000
time i'm talking about it now but i

82
00:03:58,390 --> 00:03:56,799
certainly

83
00:04:00,229 --> 00:03:58,400
recognized it had that voice in my head

84
00:04:03,589 --> 00:04:00,239
i was very aware of it

85
00:04:05,990 --> 00:04:03,599
and it set me off on my own journey

86
00:04:06,630 --> 00:04:06,000
partially about owls just because i was

87
00:04:08,789 --> 00:04:06,640
so

88
00:04:10,309 --> 00:04:08,799
intense and then afterwards i was hit

89
00:04:11,589 --> 00:04:10,319
with so many synchronicities and other

90
00:04:15,270 --> 00:04:11,599
owl sightings

91
00:04:16,789 --> 00:04:15,280
and i recognized that this was unusual

92
00:04:18,710 --> 00:04:16,799
that i was seeing owls in a

93
00:04:21,830 --> 00:04:18,720
disproportionate way than

94
00:04:25,110 --> 00:04:21,840
anyone should and i uh

95
00:04:29,270 --> 00:04:25,120
and this came at the same time

96
00:04:31,030 --> 00:04:29,280
when i was dealing with some of my own

97
00:04:32,629 --> 00:04:31,040
memories some of them from childhood

98
00:04:33,749 --> 00:04:32,639
some of them when i was a younger adult

99
00:04:36,950 --> 00:04:33,759
um

100
00:04:38,230 --> 00:04:36,960
i uh as a boy i had ufo sighting i had a

101
00:04:41,110 --> 00:04:38,240
missing time event

102
00:04:43,110 --> 00:04:41,120
um and as a young adult i woke up in the

103
00:04:46,710 --> 00:04:43,120
middle of the night and saw

104
00:04:48,710 --> 00:04:46,720
five beings five gray skinny beings

105
00:04:50,230 --> 00:04:48,720
backlit by a big bright light coming

106
00:04:52,870 --> 00:04:50,240
toward my house

107
00:04:54,150 --> 00:04:52,880
and i reacted very oddly i simply said

108
00:04:56,870 --> 00:04:54,160
um

109
00:04:58,870 --> 00:04:56,880
oh yes they're here now is the time to

110
00:05:00,790 --> 00:04:58,880
put my head on the pillow and shut down

111
00:05:02,550 --> 00:05:00,800
and that's exactly what i did and i

112
00:05:04,230 --> 00:05:02,560
and i kind of dismissed all this stuff i

113
00:05:05,990 --> 00:05:04,240
denied all this stuff i wasn't going

114
00:05:09,350 --> 00:05:06,000
into it it was all i treated it as a

115
00:05:10,790 --> 00:05:09,360
as i don't know just coincidence or odd

116
00:05:13,189 --> 00:05:10,800
dreams and

117
00:05:14,550 --> 00:05:13,199
and at the same time i knew that i had

118
00:05:19,510 --> 00:05:14,560
to look into this stuff

119
00:05:22,629 --> 00:05:19,520
so i feel my um

120
00:05:23,990 --> 00:05:22,639
my journey was stuck like i wasn't gonna

121
00:05:26,390 --> 00:05:24,000
i was like denying it

122
00:05:27,670 --> 00:05:26,400
until the owls until the owls came along

123
00:05:28,790 --> 00:05:27,680
and they sort of pushed me off the cliff

124
00:05:33,430 --> 00:05:28,800
and that's where i

125
00:05:37,029 --> 00:05:35,189
my journey would eventually culminate in

126
00:05:39,110 --> 00:05:37,039
these two big books okay

127
00:05:40,230 --> 00:05:39,120
i did i also also have a blog and a

128
00:05:41,590 --> 00:05:40,240
podcast and and

129
00:05:43,350 --> 00:05:41,600
i haven't done the podcast in ages

130
00:05:45,270 --> 00:05:43,360
though um um

131
00:05:47,909 --> 00:05:45,280
but i was very i had a you know i have a

132
00:05:48,790 --> 00:05:47,919
pretty for a little blog i felt like i

133
00:05:51,749 --> 00:05:48,800
had a pretty

134
00:05:51,990 --> 00:05:51,759
good web presence and it was it was a so

135
00:05:56,309 --> 00:05:52,000
the

136
00:06:00,629 --> 00:05:58,950
how to give it to so yes my my i would

137
00:06:02,390 --> 00:06:00,639
argue

138
00:06:03,749 --> 00:06:02,400
and i'm saying this and here's what i

139
00:06:06,150 --> 00:06:03,759
know for myself i know

140
00:06:07,270 --> 00:06:06,160
owls and ufo contact are connected i

141
00:06:08,790 --> 00:06:07,280
don't know the why of it i don't know

142
00:06:09,830 --> 00:06:08,800
the how of it i don't know what what it

143
00:06:13,270 --> 00:06:09,840
means

144
00:06:16,550 --> 00:06:13,280
but i i argue that these these two

145
00:06:18,230 --> 00:06:16,560
strange phenomena like the ufo contact

146
00:06:18,950 --> 00:06:18,240
experience and then the archetype of the

147
00:06:21,670 --> 00:06:18,960
owl

148
00:06:23,029 --> 00:06:21,680
are somehow interwoven together okay and

149
00:06:25,749 --> 00:06:23,039
that's the premise of the books

150
00:06:27,909 --> 00:06:25,759
well um i want you to name those two

151
00:06:28,550 --> 00:06:27,919
books in just a minute but before you do

152
00:06:31,670 --> 00:06:28,560
that

153
00:06:35,749 --> 00:06:31,680
i want to take you back to one thing uh

154
00:06:37,670 --> 00:06:35,759
because i've read this and i've heard it

155
00:06:39,029 --> 00:06:37,680
i've heard you speak it and i've read

156
00:06:40,950 --> 00:06:39,039
this about

157
00:06:43,830 --> 00:06:40,960
something that happened to you when i

158
00:06:48,629 --> 00:06:43,840
believe you were about 11 years old

159
00:06:50,950 --> 00:06:48,639
and there was a bright flash in the sky

160
00:06:51,909 --> 00:06:50,960
be i want you to go back to that because

161
00:06:54,870 --> 00:06:51,919
it

162
00:06:57,270 --> 00:06:54,880
mirrors my experience in two ways so

163
00:07:00,830 --> 00:06:57,280
could you just go over that a little bit

164
00:07:03,749 --> 00:07:00,840
absolutely yes so this would have been

165
00:07:05,270 --> 00:07:03,759
1970 four

166
00:07:07,189 --> 00:07:05,280
i looked up the television show that i

167
00:07:08,790 --> 00:07:07,199
was on my way home to see that night

168
00:07:10,950 --> 00:07:08,800
uh it was cold shack the nightstalker

169
00:07:13,270 --> 00:07:10,960
which is a show i loved i was

170
00:07:14,150 --> 00:07:13,280
like 12 year old kid i loved that show

171
00:07:17,189 --> 00:07:14,160
and so

172
00:07:18,070 --> 00:07:17,199
um uh there's a high school football

173
00:07:21,589 --> 00:07:18,080
game

174
00:07:23,430 --> 00:07:21,599
it was an autumn it was probably october

175
00:07:27,189 --> 00:07:23,440
i can't know for certain

176
00:07:30,230 --> 00:07:27,199
uh and i was

177
00:07:31,670 --> 00:07:30,240
uh walking home with a friend and i

178
00:07:33,749 --> 00:07:31,680
wanted to be home in time to see a

179
00:07:36,870 --> 00:07:33,759
television show

180
00:07:38,070 --> 00:07:36,880
so we were crossing the street i know

181
00:07:39,270 --> 00:07:38,080
right where it was in the neighborhood

182
00:07:41,350 --> 00:07:39,280
and we were right in front of another

183
00:07:42,950 --> 00:07:41,360
friend's house her name is cindy

184
00:07:45,189 --> 00:07:42,960
and it just happened to be we were on

185
00:07:48,390 --> 00:07:45,199
her like near her driveway

186
00:07:50,230 --> 00:07:48,400
and there was it was a calm lovely

187
00:07:52,390 --> 00:07:50,240
autumn evening there was nothing unusual

188
00:07:55,110 --> 00:07:52,400
about it pleasant

189
00:07:56,629 --> 00:07:55,120
the suburbs of way outside of detroit it

190
00:07:59,189 --> 00:07:56,639
was a safe and

191
00:07:59,909 --> 00:07:59,199
in pleasant as it could be so walking

192
00:08:01,990 --> 00:07:59,919
along

193
00:08:03,909 --> 00:08:02,000
and there and then there was a odd

194
00:08:06,309 --> 00:08:03,919
jarring flash it felt like god

195
00:08:07,270 --> 00:08:06,319
lit flipped a light switch up click and

196
00:08:10,629 --> 00:08:07,280
flipped it off

197
00:08:11,430 --> 00:08:10,639
click just on off and what happened was

198
00:08:14,070 --> 00:08:11,440
that the

199
00:08:14,869 --> 00:08:14,080
the sky this is my memory the sky turned

200
00:08:17,270 --> 00:08:14,879
bright

201
00:08:19,189 --> 00:08:17,280
orange for like one second and then went

202
00:08:22,629 --> 00:08:19,199
right back to totally calm

203
00:08:24,550 --> 00:08:22,639
there was no sound and it was extremely

204
00:08:26,790 --> 00:08:24,560
jarring and both of us were like what

205
00:08:28,550 --> 00:08:26,800
just happened i mean this is now over 40

206
00:08:30,309 --> 00:08:28,560
years ago and i remembered clearly like

207
00:08:32,870 --> 00:08:30,319
what just happened and we went through a

208
00:08:35,190 --> 00:08:32,880
little checklist was it lightning was it

209
00:08:36,389 --> 00:08:35,200
did like a did like a telephone line

210
00:08:38,790 --> 00:08:36,399
explode somewhere

211
00:08:41,509 --> 00:08:38,800
nothing made sense and we kept on

212
00:08:42,870 --> 00:08:41,519
walking in and i got to my house first i

213
00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:42,880
was closer in the neighborhood and he

214
00:08:45,110 --> 00:08:44,080
got to his house

215
00:08:46,870 --> 00:08:45,120
and he had to walk a little further

216
00:08:48,070 --> 00:08:46,880
deeper into the neighborhood to get to

217
00:08:51,190 --> 00:08:48,080
his house

218
00:08:52,630 --> 00:08:51,200
and uh so i got into i walked in the

219
00:08:53,430 --> 00:08:52,640
front door and my parents were angry at

220
00:08:56,550 --> 00:08:53,440
me

221
00:08:57,990 --> 00:08:56,560
and they're like you're you're dear to

222
00:08:59,590 --> 00:08:58,000
you can't be out this late

223
00:09:01,350 --> 00:08:59,600
what do you mean it's 9 30. i told you

224
00:09:02,710 --> 00:09:01,360
i'd be home at 9 30 it's 9 30.

225
00:09:04,550 --> 00:09:02,720
and they pointed to the clock and it was

226
00:09:06,070 --> 00:09:04,560
11 30. it was between

227
00:09:07,829 --> 00:09:06,080
it was getting close to 11 30 because

228
00:09:10,949 --> 00:09:07,839
the 11 o'clock news

229
00:09:14,550 --> 00:09:10,959
was just ending and

230
00:09:15,910 --> 00:09:14,560
i was absolutely long before i had any

231
00:09:17,269 --> 00:09:15,920
didn't you know missing time didn't mean

232
00:09:18,470 --> 00:09:17,279
anything it just was like no this

233
00:09:20,870 --> 00:09:18,480
doesn't make sense and i was

234
00:09:22,070 --> 00:09:20,880
my emotional state was i was bummed out

235
00:09:24,310 --> 00:09:22,080
because i missed that show and i was

236
00:09:25,829 --> 00:09:24,320
also really confused

237
00:09:27,350 --> 00:09:25,839
because my parents were so angry at me

238
00:09:29,110 --> 00:09:27,360
like i just didn't feel like it was

239
00:09:32,550 --> 00:09:29,120
deserved i felt like no i came home on

240
00:09:35,590 --> 00:09:32,560
time like it didn't make sense

241
00:09:37,110 --> 00:09:35,600
so go ahead and then the next monday in

242
00:09:40,150 --> 00:09:37,120
school

243
00:09:42,870 --> 00:09:40,160
um we were sitting around the

244
00:09:43,350 --> 00:09:42,880
cafeteria and one of the friends that

245
00:09:46,150 --> 00:09:43,360
was with me

246
00:09:47,030 --> 00:09:46,160
his name is mike also and he said um i

247
00:09:48,470 --> 00:09:47,040
said to the

248
00:09:49,910 --> 00:09:48,480
kids at the table like you know like

249
00:09:50,230 --> 00:09:49,920
something we saw something weird in the

250
00:09:53,350 --> 00:09:50,240
sky

251
00:09:55,190 --> 00:09:53,360
on on friday night and

252
00:09:56,949 --> 00:09:55,200
my friend mike said yeah we saw a ufo

253
00:09:58,949 --> 00:09:56,959
with lights and everything

254
00:10:00,470 --> 00:09:58,959
and i i did i just stopped because that

255
00:10:02,470 --> 00:10:00,480
was not what i saw

256
00:10:04,630 --> 00:10:02,480
i saw it i just felt like the sky lit up

257
00:10:07,430 --> 00:10:04,640
orange and i

258
00:10:07,990 --> 00:10:07,440
never brought it up to him ever again

259
00:10:11,350 --> 00:10:08,000
and i

260
00:10:14,420 --> 00:10:11,360
where i was like he's making this up

261
00:10:15,829 --> 00:10:14,430
he's exaggerating you know so um

262
00:10:19,030 --> 00:10:15,839
[Music]

263
00:10:20,389 --> 00:10:19,040
and and now i'm not i i don't

264
00:10:21,509 --> 00:10:20,399
think i should and it's on my left

265
00:10:22,630 --> 00:10:21,519
checklist of the things to do in my life

266
00:10:23,190 --> 00:10:22,640
is to get a hold of him and actually ask

267
00:10:25,590 --> 00:10:23,200
him

268
00:10:26,389 --> 00:10:25,600
well you should but i know i shouldn't

269
00:10:28,550 --> 00:10:26,399
i'm just

270
00:10:29,509 --> 00:10:28,560
i wanted you to go back to that because

271
00:10:32,310 --> 00:10:29,519
it mirrors my

272
00:10:34,150 --> 00:10:32,320
experience in two ways i don't have any

273
00:10:37,990 --> 00:10:34,160
recollection of missing time

274
00:10:41,509 --> 00:10:38,000
okay but i was around the same age

275
00:10:44,710 --> 00:10:41,519
when i had my first

276
00:10:45,750 --> 00:10:44,720
acknowledged ufo experience with a group

277
00:10:48,870 --> 00:10:45,760
of other people

278
00:10:51,910 --> 00:10:48,880
i was 11 or 12 don't remember which

279
00:10:54,949 --> 00:10:51,920
and um it wasn't with a group of people

280
00:10:58,389 --> 00:10:54,959
uh coming into a lake community

281
00:11:01,030 --> 00:10:58,399
uh coming home from um having been at a

282
00:11:03,030 --> 00:11:01,040
drive-in movie with the parents

283
00:11:04,069 --> 00:11:03,040
of a boy who i was friends with who was

284
00:11:07,110 --> 00:11:04,079
probably

285
00:11:08,790 --> 00:11:07,120
13 or 14 years old and they slowed us

286
00:11:10,069 --> 00:11:08,800
down coming into the lake community

287
00:11:13,430 --> 00:11:10,079
people stopped us

288
00:11:15,350 --> 00:11:13,440
and there was a ufo in the sky

289
00:11:16,870 --> 00:11:15,360
it was a matter of lights but it was

290
00:11:20,630 --> 00:11:16,880
they were moving very

291
00:11:21,110 --> 00:11:20,640
strangely so it was um interesting to me

292
00:11:26,790 --> 00:11:21,120
that

293
00:11:29,829 --> 00:11:26,800
saw a bright orange flash

294
00:11:30,310 --> 00:11:29,839
because in the interim since since i was

295
00:11:34,069 --> 00:11:30,320
12

296
00:11:37,350 --> 00:11:34,079
and now too many years to even uh admit

297
00:11:40,630 --> 00:11:37,360
um i have twice seen

298
00:11:44,389 --> 00:11:40,640
bright orange flashes in the sky

299
00:11:45,910 --> 00:11:44,399
and um at i spoke to some other people

300
00:11:47,509 --> 00:11:45,920
about them and said that i thought they

301
00:11:50,550 --> 00:11:47,519
were iridium flashes

302
00:11:52,470 --> 00:11:50,560
and then somebody said no that's

303
00:11:54,069 --> 00:11:52,480
it only happens at a certain time of the

304
00:11:55,590 --> 00:11:54,079
evening and you're saying this happened

305
00:11:57,590 --> 00:11:55,600
at a different time and

306
00:11:59,509 --> 00:11:57,600
so forth and so on and it was not an

307
00:12:01,590 --> 00:11:59,519
iridium flash that you saw

308
00:12:03,590 --> 00:12:01,600
you know what an iridium flash is i take

309
00:12:06,629 --> 00:12:03,600
it sure that's that's uh that's

310
00:12:09,350 --> 00:12:06,639
off the the space station usually that

311
00:12:11,829 --> 00:12:09,360
has a reflective surface that that um

312
00:12:14,470 --> 00:12:11,839
you know hits the direct sunlight yeah

313
00:12:14,870 --> 00:12:14,480
so that's the reason why i wanted to you

314
00:12:22,230 --> 00:12:14,880
to

315
00:12:25,269 --> 00:12:22,240
stage here

316
00:12:28,710 --> 00:12:25,279
where we can parse this out a little bit

317
00:12:32,470 --> 00:12:28,720
what what goes on now i've only had

318
00:12:35,350 --> 00:12:32,480
one owl experience and i am happy to say

319
00:12:37,750 --> 00:12:35,360
like when you spoke of your owls that it

320
00:12:38,470 --> 00:12:37,760
was a real owl that i saw driving in a

321
00:12:42,069 --> 00:12:38,480
car

322
00:12:44,710 --> 00:12:42,079
in maine and a a lonely

323
00:12:45,990 --> 00:12:44,720
you know two-way road well-paved but

324
00:12:50,389 --> 00:12:46,000
lonely road

325
00:12:53,829 --> 00:12:50,399
the um the foliage was about

326
00:12:54,389 --> 00:12:53,839
um several feet back from the edge i'm

327
00:12:58,629 --> 00:12:54,399
going to say

328
00:13:01,509 --> 00:12:58,639
10 feet back and i am very good at

329
00:13:03,910 --> 00:13:01,519
for a city gal i'm very good at spotting

330
00:13:07,910 --> 00:13:03,920
birds and animals in the wild

331
00:13:10,150 --> 00:13:07,920
i have an average i used to have

332
00:13:11,509 --> 00:13:10,160
relatively good vision now my vision is

333
00:13:13,670 --> 00:13:11,519
it certainly isn't terrible

334
00:13:14,710 --> 00:13:13,680
probably could use some improvement but

335
00:13:18,069 --> 00:13:14,720
at the time

336
00:13:20,790 --> 00:13:18,079
i just was driving with someone in maine

337
00:13:21,590 --> 00:13:20,800
spotted an owl and i said wow there's an

338
00:13:24,629 --> 00:13:21,600
owl

339
00:13:26,069 --> 00:13:24,639
and i asked the person to back up and

340
00:13:28,870 --> 00:13:26,079
the owl didn't move

341
00:13:30,949 --> 00:13:28,880
and the owl was just sitting there

342
00:13:32,150 --> 00:13:30,959
looking at us and we both took a look at

343
00:13:34,949 --> 00:13:32,160
the owl

344
00:13:35,590 --> 00:13:34,959
looked at each other decided to move on

345
00:13:38,710 --> 00:13:35,600
and

346
00:13:39,829 --> 00:13:38,720
that was the whole of my entire owl

347
00:13:42,949 --> 00:13:39,839
experience

348
00:13:44,710 --> 00:13:42,959
but like in your book you have other

349
00:13:46,230 --> 00:13:44,720
animals that people could have

350
00:13:49,269 --> 00:13:46,240
experiences with

351
00:13:51,750 --> 00:13:49,279
such as cats raccoons and deer all of

352
00:13:54,790 --> 00:13:51,760
which i've had experiences with

353
00:13:57,509 --> 00:13:54,800
so i just wanted to set things up to

354
00:13:59,110 --> 00:13:57,519
sort of we're on the same page with a

355
00:14:02,389 --> 00:13:59,120
lot of this stuff

356
00:14:05,590 --> 00:14:02,399
um the thing that i would

357
00:14:08,470 --> 00:14:05,600
mention here about my own point of view

358
00:14:08,949 --> 00:14:08,480
only because some of my questions are

359
00:14:11,110 --> 00:14:08,959
gonna

360
00:14:12,470 --> 00:14:11,120
like point in that direction and i try

361
00:14:15,350 --> 00:14:12,480
to be

362
00:14:16,069 --> 00:14:15,360
uh i try not to have a strong opinion

363
00:14:19,430 --> 00:14:16,079
about stuff

364
00:14:22,710 --> 00:14:19,440
i try to stay open and sort of

365
00:14:24,230 --> 00:14:22,720
um gnostic with a small g you know i

366
00:14:26,069 --> 00:14:24,240
don't know what it means this is what

367
00:14:28,949 --> 00:14:26,079
i've experienced kind of thing

368
00:14:31,350 --> 00:14:28,959
but one thing that i am mostly in

369
00:14:35,189 --> 00:14:31,360
opposition to most of the

370
00:14:36,150 --> 00:14:35,199
uh uh researchers is that i am not

371
00:14:39,269 --> 00:14:36,160
convinced

372
00:14:43,110 --> 00:14:39,279
that humans are the crown of creation so

373
00:14:46,389 --> 00:14:43,120
um i am all open to the idea that owls

374
00:14:50,150 --> 00:14:46,399
or um cats for instance

375
00:14:52,949 --> 00:14:50,160
could have much more going on

376
00:14:53,590 --> 00:14:52,959
than we give them credit for as humans

377
00:14:57,030 --> 00:14:53,600
humans

378
00:14:59,110 --> 00:14:57,040
are very um anthropocentric

379
00:15:00,949 --> 00:14:59,120
as they probably should be on a certain

380
00:15:02,069 --> 00:15:00,959
level but they you know they have a

381
00:15:03,910 --> 00:15:02,079
really good

382
00:15:06,069 --> 00:15:03,920
opinion of themselves which i don't

383
00:15:07,910 --> 00:15:06,079
necessarily share which doesn't mean i i

384
00:15:09,590 --> 00:15:07,920
certainly don't hate anybody but

385
00:15:11,590 --> 00:15:09,600
i think you get where i'm going sure

386
00:15:13,990 --> 00:15:11,600
sure yeah

387
00:15:15,110 --> 00:15:14,000
yeah you know it's the so the the owl is

388
00:15:17,350 --> 00:15:15,120
um

389
00:15:18,629 --> 00:15:17,360
i g the way i describe my research in a

390
00:15:20,870 --> 00:15:18,639
way is that there comes a point when you

391
00:15:24,550 --> 00:15:20,880
have to take your ufo investigator hat

392
00:15:27,030 --> 00:15:24,560
off and replace it with your shaman hat

393
00:15:29,990 --> 00:15:27,040
and treat the you know so the so if you

394
00:15:31,990 --> 00:15:30,000
invest ufo investigator

395
00:15:33,350 --> 00:15:32,000
someone has an experience they contact

396
00:15:38,150 --> 00:15:33,360
the ufo investigator

397
00:15:39,670 --> 00:15:38,160
questions the correct questions they'll

398
00:15:41,509 --> 00:15:39,680
say what time was it

399
00:15:42,949 --> 00:15:41,519
which direction was it traveling could

400
00:15:45,350 --> 00:15:42,959
you draw a picture of it

401
00:15:47,590 --> 00:15:45,360
they'll call the airport they'll check

402
00:15:49,189 --> 00:15:47,600
the radar returns on the on the

403
00:15:50,790 --> 00:15:49,199
from the control tower they'll do very

404
00:15:52,470 --> 00:15:50,800
very straight pragmatic things

405
00:15:54,470 --> 00:15:52,480
call the sheriff's department did anyone

406
00:15:55,509 --> 00:15:54,480
else those are all the correct things to

407
00:15:57,829 --> 00:15:55,519
do

408
00:15:59,189 --> 00:15:57,839
you take your ufo investigator hat off

409
00:16:01,189 --> 00:15:59,199
and you ask that what you put your

410
00:16:03,269 --> 00:16:01,199
shaman hat on and you ask

411
00:16:04,790 --> 00:16:03,279
what was going on in your life before

412
00:16:09,829 --> 00:16:04,800
the sighting

413
00:16:12,230 --> 00:16:09,839
your spirituality changed

414
00:16:13,590 --> 00:16:12,240
do you have psychic abilities are you a

415
00:16:14,230 --> 00:16:13,600
creative type i mean these are the

416
00:16:17,509 --> 00:16:14,240
questions i

417
00:16:18,870 --> 00:16:17,519
ask and and those are

418
00:16:21,110 --> 00:16:18,880
this is and you know what's very

419
00:16:22,790 --> 00:16:21,120
interesting i i

420
00:16:24,389 --> 00:16:22,800
i'm not affiliated with mufon at all and

421
00:16:25,590 --> 00:16:24,399
someone handed me the paperwork one time

422
00:16:26,949 --> 00:16:25,600
i asked and said hey can you go to be

423
00:16:27,829 --> 00:16:26,959
one of those forms that you fill out and

424
00:16:31,110 --> 00:16:27,839
they did i did

425
00:16:32,710 --> 00:16:31,120
and one of the questions is on the form

426
00:16:35,030 --> 00:16:32,720
very pragmatic form

427
00:16:36,870 --> 00:16:35,040
one of the questions is have you had any

428
00:16:39,509 --> 00:16:36,880
psychic experiences

429
00:16:39,910 --> 00:16:39,519
or has your psychic ability improved

430
00:16:42,230 --> 00:16:39,920
since

431
00:16:43,269 --> 00:16:42,240
your ufo sighting so even a very very

432
00:16:45,350 --> 00:16:43,279
dry conservative

433
00:16:46,949 --> 00:16:45,360
organization like like mufon is well

434
00:16:50,069 --> 00:16:46,959
aware of the of this

435
00:16:53,430 --> 00:16:50,079
shift that takes place in the observer

436
00:16:56,069 --> 00:16:53,440
um so uh

437
00:16:57,350 --> 00:16:56,079
yes and then so let's say let's say

438
00:16:59,350 --> 00:16:57,360
instead of a ufo

439
00:17:00,470 --> 00:16:59,360
now i'm at the point now where i treat

440
00:17:02,829 --> 00:17:00,480
ufos

441
00:17:04,309 --> 00:17:02,839
and owls and synchronicities powerful

442
00:17:05,829 --> 00:17:04,319
synchronicities

443
00:17:07,829 --> 00:17:05,839
for a thought experiment i treat them

444
00:17:09,110 --> 00:17:07,839
all as this as the same thing right so

445
00:17:11,829 --> 00:17:09,120
you can have a powerful

446
00:17:13,270 --> 00:17:11,839
synchronicity and it can influence your

447
00:17:15,029 --> 00:17:13,280
life you can have a powerful ufo

448
00:17:16,789 --> 00:17:15,039
sighting and it can influence your life

449
00:17:18,390 --> 00:17:16,799
and you can have a powerful owl sighting

450
00:17:19,909 --> 00:17:18,400
i have some stories and it will

451
00:17:22,069 --> 00:17:19,919
i've talked to people it has changed

452
00:17:24,150 --> 00:17:22,079
their lives i've got many stories

453
00:17:25,990 --> 00:17:24,160
now so if you were let's turn the clock

454
00:17:28,069 --> 00:17:26,000
back 400 years if you're living in the

455
00:17:31,270 --> 00:17:28,079
plains of north dakota and you have a

456
00:17:32,789 --> 00:17:31,280
bunch of strange owl experiences right

457
00:17:34,310 --> 00:17:32,799
who do you go to you walk to the edge of

458
00:17:36,150 --> 00:17:34,320
the village village

459
00:17:38,070 --> 00:17:36,160
and you kind of knock on the door of the

460
00:17:41,110 --> 00:17:38,080
teepee where the shaman lives

461
00:17:42,789 --> 00:17:41,120
and you discuss your owl experiences now

462
00:17:45,110 --> 00:17:42,799
this shaman i can't

463
00:17:49,430 --> 00:17:45,120
i can't begin to guess what he might say

464
00:17:55,350 --> 00:17:52,870
spiritual place of of

465
00:17:56,630 --> 00:17:55,360
examining the issues with a with a

466
00:17:59,070 --> 00:17:56,640
broader outlook

467
00:18:00,710 --> 00:17:59,080
with a with a i would say like a

468
00:18:03,270 --> 00:18:00,720
multi-layered

469
00:18:05,029 --> 00:18:03,280
vision of reality and that that's where

470
00:18:08,950 --> 00:18:05,039
i'm coming from as far as this

471
00:18:12,070 --> 00:18:08,960
this research okay well

472
00:18:14,789 --> 00:18:12,080
i i understand that um

473
00:18:16,230 --> 00:18:14,799
and i am just trying to parse this out

474
00:18:19,190 --> 00:18:16,240
for myself

475
00:18:20,230 --> 00:18:19,200
as well as you know talk to you i would

476
00:18:22,310 --> 00:18:20,240
like you now

477
00:18:24,549 --> 00:18:22,320
although we've we've gone off a little

478
00:18:26,070 --> 00:18:24,559
bit i do want you to mention your books

479
00:18:28,630 --> 00:18:26,080
and where people can get them and all

480
00:18:30,150 --> 00:18:28,640
that because i think that's important

481
00:18:31,750 --> 00:18:30,160
great so my books are there are two

482
00:18:34,310 --> 00:18:31,760
books one is called the messengers

483
00:18:35,830 --> 00:18:34,320
and it's subtitled owls synchronicity

484
00:18:38,310 --> 00:18:35,840
and the ufo abductee

485
00:18:39,830 --> 00:18:38,320
and that was my first book um and that's

486
00:18:41,430 --> 00:18:39,840
the one where i argue

487
00:18:42,789 --> 00:18:41,440
like i try to make the case that owls

488
00:18:43,830 --> 00:18:42,799
and ufos are connected it's kind of a

489
00:18:45,669 --> 00:18:43,840
big fat book it's

490
00:18:47,750 --> 00:18:45,679
getting close to 400 pages and so i feel

491
00:18:48,470 --> 00:18:47,760
like i've made my case pretty strongly

492
00:18:49,990 --> 00:18:48,480
on that one

493
00:18:51,590 --> 00:18:50,000
and what happened when i did the first

494
00:18:53,190 --> 00:18:51,600
book is i

495
00:18:54,390 --> 00:18:53,200
talked to people and you've probably you

496
00:18:55,430 --> 00:18:54,400
probably know just what i'm talking

497
00:18:57,110 --> 00:18:55,440
about you talked to someone on the phone

498
00:18:58,870 --> 00:18:57,120
about their experiences

499
00:19:02,710 --> 00:18:58,880
and for them to really tell their story

500
00:19:06,470 --> 00:19:02,720
it's a it's five or six hours sometimes

501
00:19:10,150 --> 00:19:08,549
and so i would talk to many people on

502
00:19:10,870 --> 00:19:10,160
the phone have long conversations with

503
00:19:12,390 --> 00:19:10,880
them and then i'd

504
00:19:14,710 --> 00:19:12,400
write their owl thing up so they had

505
00:19:16,870 --> 00:19:14,720
this grand novel of a

506
00:19:18,390 --> 00:19:16,880
life story and then i would put two

507
00:19:19,669 --> 00:19:18,400
paragraphs in where they saw their owl

508
00:19:21,669 --> 00:19:19,679
and it broke my heart so

509
00:19:22,789 --> 00:19:21,679
the second book is called stories from

510
00:19:25,669 --> 00:19:22,799
the messengers

511
00:19:27,029 --> 00:19:25,679
and it's subtitled accounts of owls ufos

512
00:19:29,430 --> 00:19:27,039
in a deeper reality

513
00:19:30,549 --> 00:19:29,440
and that's 19 chapters each chapter digs

514
00:19:33,909 --> 00:19:30,559
into a personal

515
00:19:35,830 --> 00:19:33,919
story very personal story and i

516
00:19:37,350 --> 00:19:35,840
tried to tell those stories completely

517
00:19:40,950 --> 00:19:37,360
and the in the thread

518
00:19:42,630 --> 00:19:40,960
of anything is the the the

519
00:19:46,390 --> 00:19:42,640
what makes the story similar is the

520
00:19:49,190 --> 00:19:46,400
strangeness this kind of illogical

521
00:19:50,549 --> 00:19:49,200
nodded tangled strangeness that these

522
00:19:54,150 --> 00:19:50,559
stories take on

523
00:19:56,390 --> 00:19:54,160
yes and um and i think that's part of it

524
00:19:57,909 --> 00:19:56,400
and i think that's why i know some some

525
00:19:59,510 --> 00:19:57,919
ufo researchers i would know one guy who

526
00:20:01,830 --> 00:19:59,520
said it he's just said like i

527
00:20:02,950 --> 00:20:01,840
i can't do abduction research it's just

528
00:20:05,909 --> 00:20:02,960
too time consuming

529
00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:05,919
and he's right you know like and it's so

530
00:20:08,310 --> 00:20:07,440
so i feel i'm really happy i did the

531
00:20:09,909 --> 00:20:08,320
second book

532
00:20:11,350 --> 00:20:09,919
as a companion book because it really as

533
00:20:14,549 --> 00:20:11,360
i said it broke my heart to

534
00:20:16,230 --> 00:20:14,559
to just um you know hear these amazing

535
00:20:17,909 --> 00:20:16,240
powerful stories and not honor those in

536
00:20:18,789 --> 00:20:17,919
some ways so that was the the goal of

537
00:20:20,310 --> 00:20:18,799
the second book

538
00:20:21,909 --> 00:20:20,320
um those are easy to find you can get

539
00:20:23,430 --> 00:20:21,919
them on amazon you can just if you

540
00:20:25,190 --> 00:20:23,440
and if you're looking for me in my site

541
00:20:27,750 --> 00:20:25,200
here's the easiest thing to do google

542
00:20:28,950 --> 00:20:27,760
ufos and owls and i am the first

543
00:20:31,270 --> 00:20:28,960
thing that comes up and then i'm about

544
00:20:34,710 --> 00:20:31,280
the next 15 things under that so

545
00:20:36,110 --> 00:20:34,720
uh and then you can uh google my name

546
00:20:37,909 --> 00:20:36,120
there's a i have a website called

547
00:20:39,750 --> 00:20:37,919
mikecleland.com that doesn't really do

548
00:20:41,990 --> 00:20:39,760
much except take you to my other

549
00:20:43,270 --> 00:20:42,000
site which is called hidden experience

550
00:20:43,669 --> 00:20:43,280
and that's my blog that i've been

551
00:20:45,430 --> 00:20:43,679
running

552
00:20:48,230 --> 00:20:45,440
10 years just a few just last week it

553
00:20:51,830 --> 00:20:48,240
was 10 years the vlog has been going so

554
00:20:52,390 --> 00:20:51,840
um hidden experience.blogspot.com and i

555
00:20:55,830 --> 00:20:52,400
have about

556
00:20:56,390 --> 00:20:55,840
200 hours of archived podcasts on that

557
00:20:59,029 --> 00:20:56,400
site

558
00:20:59,590 --> 00:20:59,039
wow yes well you are you're ahead of us

559
00:21:03,590 --> 00:20:59,600
we're

560
00:21:05,270 --> 00:21:03,600
of the shows were two hours long many of

561
00:21:07,590 --> 00:21:05,280
the shows were two hours long so

562
00:21:08,870 --> 00:21:07,600
well some of ours are an hour and 15 20

563
00:21:13,590 --> 00:21:08,880
minutes but that's

564
00:21:17,510 --> 00:21:13,600
that's basically about it now um

565
00:21:21,430 --> 00:21:17,520
there's this thing let's go back

566
00:21:21,909 --> 00:21:21,440
to the animals and um i have here you

567
00:21:25,029 --> 00:21:21,919
know

568
00:21:27,350 --> 00:21:25,039
talking about owls and

569
00:21:29,590 --> 00:21:27,360
i have experiences with cats lots of

570
00:21:31,510 --> 00:21:29,600
experiences with cats with raccoons and

571
00:21:35,350 --> 00:21:31,520
with deer

572
00:21:38,870 --> 00:21:35,360
i also am aware of what seems to be

573
00:21:42,149 --> 00:21:38,880
a recognized fact that squids

574
00:21:45,190 --> 00:21:42,159
are psychic um are you aware of that

575
00:21:45,909 --> 00:21:45,200
i had no idea no well i mean just just

576
00:21:47,750 --> 00:21:45,919
for the record

577
00:21:49,510 --> 00:21:47,760
uh because we're kind of conversational

578
00:21:51,830 --> 00:21:49,520
here and it's

579
00:21:52,549 --> 00:21:51,840
squish there was a squid and it's not

580
00:21:55,190 --> 00:21:52,559
the only

581
00:21:56,149 --> 00:21:55,200
such squid there was a squid that was

582
00:21:59,190 --> 00:21:56,159
being held

583
00:22:02,470 --> 00:21:59,200
in a um a laboratory

584
00:22:05,990 --> 00:22:02,480
in germany and um the squid

585
00:22:06,870 --> 00:22:06,000
was able to pick out who was going to

586
00:22:10,390 --> 00:22:06,880
win

587
00:22:12,630 --> 00:22:10,400
uh the foosball the soccer championship

588
00:22:14,230 --> 00:22:12,640
and this went on it it picked out the

589
00:22:15,110 --> 00:22:14,240
winners it picked out the winners and

590
00:22:17,830 --> 00:22:15,120
finally

591
00:22:19,830 --> 00:22:17,840
apparently now i'm probably going back

592
00:22:20,630 --> 00:22:19,840
two or three years and i'm not a soccer

593
00:22:24,310 --> 00:22:20,640
fan

594
00:22:27,669 --> 00:22:24,320
um but apparently someone got upset

595
00:22:29,990 --> 00:22:27,679
that the squid picked out the team

596
00:22:33,270 --> 00:22:30,000
opposite their team and they came in and

597
00:22:37,430 --> 00:22:35,750
soccer hooligans yes soccer full again

598
00:22:40,549 --> 00:22:37,440
so i'm not sure that

599
00:22:41,350 --> 00:22:40,559
um humans are on top of the food chain

600
00:22:44,470 --> 00:22:41,360
here

601
00:22:47,350 --> 00:22:44,480
um in any case we certainly are prolific

602
00:22:51,110 --> 00:22:47,360
and there are a lot of us here humans

603
00:22:54,630 --> 00:22:51,120
but squids are apparently quite psychic

604
00:22:58,390 --> 00:22:54,640
there are apparently squid

605
00:23:01,590 --> 00:22:58,400
villages uh north of

606
00:23:04,390 --> 00:23:01,600
australia deep in the ocean where

607
00:23:06,230 --> 00:23:04,400
huge numbers of squid live together this

608
00:23:08,310 --> 00:23:06,240
is not about their intelligence but just

609
00:23:10,710 --> 00:23:08,320
new things that have been found out

610
00:23:11,750 --> 00:23:10,720
about squids in the indian ocean and so

611
00:23:13,830 --> 00:23:11,760
forth but

612
00:23:15,029 --> 00:23:13,840
my i guess my point in saying this is

613
00:23:18,549 --> 00:23:15,039
that there

614
00:23:21,190 --> 00:23:18,559
are so many things that certain animals

615
00:23:24,470 --> 00:23:21,200
can do that we don't recognize and

616
00:23:26,950 --> 00:23:24,480
trees talk to one another and like

617
00:23:27,750 --> 00:23:26,960
personally i'm so much about all of that

618
00:23:30,870 --> 00:23:27,760
the bears

619
00:23:32,470 --> 00:23:30,880
and the the trees and uh and so forth

620
00:23:36,390 --> 00:23:32,480
and not so much

621
00:23:41,510 --> 00:23:36,400
about the preeminence of humans

622
00:23:48,149 --> 00:23:45,269
what what other senses can owls have

623
00:23:50,549 --> 00:23:48,159
beyond excellent vision and hearing that

624
00:23:53,750 --> 00:23:50,559
humans don't have

625
00:23:56,310 --> 00:23:53,760
well so owls are well just

626
00:23:57,590 --> 00:23:56,320
on a let's take a half a step back and

627
00:23:59,909 --> 00:23:57,600
just on the pure

628
00:24:01,990 --> 00:23:59,919
just the presence of an owl right you

629
00:24:03,510 --> 00:24:02,000
see and so a hawk and an eagle are very

630
00:24:05,029 --> 00:24:03,520
majestic

631
00:24:07,110 --> 00:24:05,039
and they're wonderful birds beautiful

632
00:24:09,990 --> 00:24:07,120
strong wonderful birds

633
00:24:10,310 --> 00:24:10,000
they have a vibe about them yes an owl

634
00:24:13,590 --> 00:24:10,320
has

635
00:24:15,110 --> 00:24:13,600
completely different vibe

636
00:24:17,269 --> 00:24:15,120
and so i have talked to many people

637
00:24:19,510 --> 00:24:17,279
who've seen an owl an ordinary owl

638
00:24:20,789 --> 00:24:19,520
and they they basically say it's

639
00:24:22,310 --> 00:24:20,799
unnerving

640
00:24:23,909 --> 00:24:22,320
it's like unsettling to be in the

641
00:24:24,470 --> 00:24:23,919
presence of an owl i've heard that many

642
00:24:26,310 --> 00:24:24,480
times

643
00:24:28,470 --> 00:24:26,320
from there's no nothing paranormal at

644
00:24:30,149 --> 00:24:28,480
all you know owl

645
00:24:31,750 --> 00:24:30,159
lands in a fence post and everyone sees

646
00:24:33,190 --> 00:24:31,760
the owl and everyone gets gets kind of

647
00:24:35,110 --> 00:24:33,200
the heebie-jeebies from it

648
00:24:37,510 --> 00:24:35,120
that's very common and i suspect that

649
00:24:39,909 --> 00:24:37,520
has been common throughout the ages

650
00:24:41,990 --> 00:24:39,919
that people and i and there's a

651
00:24:42,630 --> 00:24:42,000
mythology around owls that that grew up

652
00:24:44,710 --> 00:24:42,640
around that

653
00:24:46,390 --> 00:24:44,720
that intensity right they have those big

654
00:24:47,669 --> 00:24:46,400
eyes and they have a so one of the

655
00:24:48,310 --> 00:24:47,679
things that owls have is a head

656
00:24:51,909 --> 00:24:48,320
stability

657
00:24:54,070 --> 00:24:51,919
they have that

658
00:24:55,430 --> 00:24:54,080
so you and i have eyeballs right there

659
00:24:58,549 --> 00:24:55,440
spheres

660
00:25:00,230 --> 00:24:58,559
in our skull and we can

661
00:25:01,750 --> 00:25:00,240
turn our we can look straight but make

662
00:25:03,990 --> 00:25:01,760
our eyes look right and left

663
00:25:04,950 --> 00:25:04,000
um owls cannot do that they do their

664
00:25:06,710 --> 00:25:04,960
eyeballs are not

665
00:25:08,230 --> 00:25:06,720
spheres they're they're actually like

666
00:25:09,909 --> 00:25:08,240
little cone shaped they're actually

667
00:25:12,070 --> 00:25:09,919
mushroom shaped almost

668
00:25:12,950 --> 00:25:12,080
so they they have they are locked in

669
00:25:14,549 --> 00:25:12,960
position so

670
00:25:16,230 --> 00:25:14,559
in order for an owl to see right and

671
00:25:17,110 --> 00:25:16,240
left it has to turn its head right and

672
00:25:20,070 --> 00:25:17,120
left

673
00:25:21,590 --> 00:25:20,080
um so that's and then they do that they

674
00:25:25,269 --> 00:25:21,600
can do that in flight

675
00:25:27,990 --> 00:25:25,279
they also fly extremely quietly

676
00:25:28,630 --> 00:25:28,000
like an un unnervingly silent and and

677
00:25:29,909 --> 00:25:28,640
then

678
00:25:31,909 --> 00:25:29,919
so i make constantly i'm making

679
00:25:38,070 --> 00:25:31,919
comparisons to owls and ufos

680
00:25:39,750 --> 00:25:38,080
um owls fly with eerie silence and ufos

681
00:25:41,269 --> 00:25:39,760
are often reported as flying with an

682
00:25:45,269 --> 00:25:41,279
eerie silence

683
00:25:47,830 --> 00:25:45,279
so the owl can fly

684
00:25:48,789 --> 00:25:47,840
in the dark with those great big eyes

685
00:25:51,029 --> 00:25:48,799
they can see

686
00:25:52,470 --> 00:25:51,039
very clearly with almost no visible

687
00:25:54,870 --> 00:25:52,480
light you know that what would be

688
00:25:57,990 --> 00:25:54,880
complete in total darkness for you and i

689
00:25:58,549 --> 00:25:58,000
an owl would be completely capable of

690
00:26:01,750 --> 00:25:58,559
flying

691
00:26:05,590 --> 00:26:01,760
in a forest in the dark

692
00:26:09,510 --> 00:26:05,600
and then they hunt so a falcon hunts by

693
00:26:09,990 --> 00:26:09,520
flying very very fast and a owl hunts by

694
00:26:11,830 --> 00:26:10,000
flying

695
00:26:13,110 --> 00:26:11,840
slowly because they want to make as

696
00:26:16,310 --> 00:26:13,120
little noise as possible

697
00:26:17,190 --> 00:26:16,320
so they are actually listening for their

698
00:26:20,310 --> 00:26:17,200
prey

699
00:26:20,950 --> 00:26:20,320
while in flight in the dark in a forest

700
00:26:23,029 --> 00:26:20,960
which is

701
00:26:24,390 --> 00:26:23,039
remarkable to me that they can they fly

702
00:26:27,269 --> 00:26:24,400
in the dark

703
00:26:27,830 --> 00:26:27,279
and listen for the sound of a mouse

704
00:26:31,830 --> 00:26:27,840
walking

705
00:26:35,029 --> 00:26:31,840
on the the forest floor wow

706
00:26:37,110 --> 00:26:35,039
so is so yes they're a uniquely

707
00:26:38,710 --> 00:26:37,120
skilled animal and i make a little bit

708
00:26:41,750 --> 00:26:38,720
of an argument in the book

709
00:26:43,830 --> 00:26:41,760
that um so there's one case uh someone's

710
00:26:46,310 --> 00:26:43,840
driving down the road

711
00:26:47,590 --> 00:26:46,320
and an owl plops out of the sky and

712
00:26:48,950 --> 00:26:47,600
lands right in front of them on the road

713
00:26:50,870 --> 00:26:48,960
and they stop their car

714
00:26:52,549 --> 00:26:50,880
and this owl is kind of flopping around

715
00:26:55,830 --> 00:26:52,559
totally disoriented

716
00:26:57,750 --> 00:26:55,840
and they look up and there's a there's a

717
00:26:59,830 --> 00:26:57,760
flying saucer and they have a close

718
00:27:01,269 --> 00:26:59,840
encounter experience with this flying

719
00:27:03,830 --> 00:27:01,279
saucers now

720
00:27:05,269 --> 00:27:03,840
did the did something so here's an

721
00:27:08,950 --> 00:27:05,279
animal with unique

722
00:27:11,750 --> 00:27:08,960
hearing abilities uniquely adapted ears

723
00:27:13,750 --> 00:27:11,760
did something in the ufo disorient the

724
00:27:15,750 --> 00:27:13,760
owl i mean that's the implication

725
00:27:17,110 --> 00:27:15,760
that the story gives us there's

726
00:27:19,110 --> 00:27:17,120
obviously no way to know

727
00:27:20,710 --> 00:27:19,120
but but that's that's sort of implied in

728
00:27:23,269 --> 00:27:20,720
the story so

729
00:27:25,590 --> 00:27:23,279
you know is the owl so sensitive at

730
00:27:27,350 --> 00:27:25,600
hearing that it can actually hear a ufo

731
00:27:29,990 --> 00:27:27,360
when we hear nothing but silence

732
00:27:30,630 --> 00:27:30,000
i mean is a ufo like a giant dog whistle

733
00:27:33,669 --> 00:27:30,640
to an owl

734
00:27:36,870 --> 00:27:33,679
aha yeah that's that's that's certainly

735
00:27:39,909 --> 00:27:36,880
an interesting concept

736
00:27:43,909 --> 00:27:39,919
um to consider because

737
00:27:47,590 --> 00:27:43,919
uh owls and uh bats i guess

738
00:27:49,510 --> 00:27:47,600
and um dogs and cats certainly

739
00:27:51,190 --> 00:27:49,520
have a different sense of hearing than

740
00:27:53,590 --> 00:27:51,200
we do when owls have a

741
00:27:55,750 --> 00:27:53,600
even higher sense of hearing i suspect

742
00:27:57,669 --> 00:27:55,760
than dogs and cats

743
00:27:59,590 --> 00:27:57,679
owls are unique in the animal kingdom

744
00:28:00,070 --> 00:27:59,600
there's nothing that can compare to

745
00:28:07,350 --> 00:28:00,080
their

746
00:28:11,590 --> 00:28:07,360
so let's step back just a little bit

747
00:28:15,029 --> 00:28:11,600
and let me ask you if you think

748
00:28:18,870 --> 00:28:15,039
that the um

749
00:28:22,070 --> 00:28:18,880
phenomenon of ufo

750
00:28:22,870 --> 00:28:22,080
the ufo phenomenon is one thing or more

751
00:28:26,950 --> 00:28:22,880
than one thing

752
00:28:31,350 --> 00:28:26,960
is it a phenomenon or a phenomena

753
00:28:34,870 --> 00:28:31,360
well i mean i've yes so it's it's a

754
00:28:37,990 --> 00:28:34,880
oh there's like a

755
00:28:40,070 --> 00:28:38,000
uh it's many many things right so it's

756
00:28:42,070 --> 00:28:40,080
citing it's people people who have ufo

757
00:28:44,070 --> 00:28:42,080
sightings often have accompanying dreams

758
00:28:45,990 --> 00:28:44,080
so how does it get in their head to do a

759
00:28:47,350 --> 00:28:46,000
dream is it a big metal spaceship that

760
00:28:49,830 --> 00:28:47,360
is putting the dream in their head how

761
00:28:50,470 --> 00:28:49,840
did that happen um there are people who

762
00:28:52,310 --> 00:28:50,480
have

763
00:28:54,549 --> 00:28:52,320
you know psychic abilities after their

764
00:28:57,909 --> 00:28:54,559
ufo contact how did that happen so it's

765
00:28:59,269 --> 00:28:57,919
so you know is you know we can like we

766
00:29:00,470 --> 00:28:59,279
fly into

767
00:29:03,110 --> 00:29:00,480
yellowstone national park in the

768
00:29:06,389 --> 00:29:03,120
helicopter we shoot and dart

769
00:29:08,149 --> 00:29:06,399
grizzly bears and then we you know we do

770
00:29:10,630 --> 00:29:08,159
medical exams on them and then we get in

771
00:29:12,710 --> 00:29:10,640
our helicopter and we fly back and the

772
00:29:14,710 --> 00:29:12,720
grizzly bear wakes up all disoriented

773
00:29:15,590 --> 00:29:14,720
and has this strange memory so yes we

774
00:29:19,510 --> 00:29:15,600
can we have a

775
00:29:21,909 --> 00:29:19,520
like an analogy that we can and that

776
00:29:23,350 --> 00:29:21,919
falls apart when you really examine it

777
00:29:25,110 --> 00:29:23,360
right if you just look at the surface

778
00:29:27,750 --> 00:29:25,120
level of the ufo experience

779
00:29:29,029 --> 00:29:27,760
right sure it's perfect right you dig

780
00:29:30,870 --> 00:29:29,039
just

781
00:29:33,430 --> 00:29:30,880
one millimeter below the waterline and

782
00:29:34,950 --> 00:29:33,440
then it all falls apart because

783
00:29:37,110 --> 00:29:34,960
i'm gonna say i'm people who have these

784
00:29:38,149 --> 00:29:37,120
experiences end up as psychics not

785
00:29:41,830 --> 00:29:38,159
everyone

786
00:29:44,389 --> 00:29:41,840
but but it's it's a recognized

787
00:29:45,990 --> 00:29:44,399
side effect within some parts of the

788
00:29:47,909 --> 00:29:46,000
research community

789
00:29:49,669 --> 00:29:47,919
yes so my sense is that there's a

790
00:29:51,590 --> 00:29:49,679
there's a wheel with a lot of spokes on

791
00:29:52,789 --> 00:29:51,600
it right you know one spoke says ufo

792
00:29:56,950 --> 00:29:52,799
sighting one says

793
00:29:58,149 --> 00:29:56,960
uh you know prophetic dreams one says um

794
00:30:00,230 --> 00:29:58,159
you know so there's all these things

795
00:30:02,549 --> 00:30:00,240
that are connected to the ufo contact

796
00:30:03,430 --> 00:30:02,559
but what i'm interested in i have no

797
00:30:05,269 --> 00:30:03,440
answer at

798
00:30:06,710 --> 00:30:05,279
all to what it might be but what is at

799
00:30:08,870 --> 00:30:06,720
the hub of that

800
00:30:10,870 --> 00:30:08,880
wheel what's at the axle where all those

801
00:30:12,470 --> 00:30:10,880
spoi spokes joined together what's at

802
00:30:13,909 --> 00:30:12,480
the core of this

803
00:30:15,750 --> 00:30:13,919
that's to me is the mystery i don't

804
00:30:17,590 --> 00:30:15,760
think well we're not going to solve that

805
00:30:19,750 --> 00:30:17,600
but we can certainly dance around it and

806
00:30:21,830 --> 00:30:19,760
and we can certainly

807
00:30:23,669 --> 00:30:21,840
you know look at the the stories that

808
00:30:26,710 --> 00:30:23,679
are connected to ufo contact and see

809
00:30:29,590 --> 00:30:26,720
see what they imply okay so

810
00:30:30,549 --> 00:30:29,600
um you answered one part of the question

811
00:30:33,389 --> 00:30:30,559
and i will

812
00:30:34,710 --> 00:30:33,399
share with you that i consider myself an

813
00:30:37,830 --> 00:30:34,720
experiencer

814
00:30:41,110 --> 00:30:37,840
i have never been hypnotized

815
00:30:42,230 --> 00:30:41,120
to determine what was the nature like am

816
00:30:45,269 --> 00:30:42,240
i an abductee

817
00:30:48,789 --> 00:30:45,279
or a a a uh

818
00:30:51,990 --> 00:30:48,799
um geez what's the other group of people

819
00:30:52,789 --> 00:30:52,000
oh experience or contactees and yeah the

820
00:30:55,990 --> 00:30:52,799
other group

821
00:30:59,350 --> 00:30:56,000
the uh contactees yes contactees i am an

822
00:31:01,350 --> 00:30:59,360
experiencer i fully admit to being in

823
00:31:02,389 --> 00:31:01,360
being an experiencer and i have worked

824
00:31:04,789 --> 00:31:02,399
as a psychic

825
00:31:05,909 --> 00:31:04,799
through most of my adult life i didn't

826
00:31:07,190 --> 00:31:05,919
know that i didn't know that that's

827
00:31:10,149 --> 00:31:07,200
wonderful okay yes

828
00:31:11,750 --> 00:31:10,159
so there's a lot of synchronicity going

829
00:31:15,269 --> 00:31:11,760
on here already

830
00:31:19,269 --> 00:31:15,279
but the question that i am asking

831
00:31:22,389 --> 00:31:19,279
is do you believe that there could be

832
00:31:25,590 --> 00:31:22,399
more than one thing causing

833
00:31:29,190 --> 00:31:25,600
these experiences to wit

834
00:31:31,110 --> 00:31:29,200
um somebody might see a nuts and bolts

835
00:31:34,870 --> 00:31:31,120
typecraft that might

836
00:31:37,909 --> 00:31:34,880
have uh certain uh aspects to it

837
00:31:40,789 --> 00:31:37,919
like leave as you have written even

838
00:31:42,710 --> 00:31:40,799
in your books trace evidence looking for

839
00:31:46,870 --> 00:31:42,720
marks where it came down

840
00:31:49,750 --> 00:31:46,880
maybe finding um these magnesium

841
00:31:51,269 --> 00:31:49,760
pieces these magnesium weird magnesium

842
00:31:53,509 --> 00:31:51,279
traces that have been

843
00:31:57,190 --> 00:31:53,519
held in front of us for a while over the

844
00:32:00,789 --> 00:31:57,200
course of years since the 50s

845
00:32:04,149 --> 00:32:00,799
and then there could be some other

846
00:32:07,029 --> 00:32:04,159
experience uh which

847
00:32:09,029 --> 00:32:07,039
seems to be an unidentified flying

848
00:32:12,710 --> 00:32:09,039
object which could be

849
00:32:13,590 --> 00:32:12,720
um a an orb and isn't a nuts and bolts

850
00:32:15,110 --> 00:32:13,600
craft so

851
00:32:16,630 --> 00:32:15,120
what i'm saying is do you think that

852
00:32:20,149 --> 00:32:16,640
there's more than one

853
00:32:23,110 --> 00:32:20,159
cause for the ufo

854
00:32:24,789 --> 00:32:23,120
experience can there be more than one

855
00:32:26,310 --> 00:32:24,799
progenitor is that the right word i

856
00:32:29,990 --> 00:32:26,320
don't even know

857
00:32:33,190 --> 00:32:30,000
yeah you know i guess so my sense is

858
00:32:34,389 --> 00:32:33,200
and i might be wrong is that there's a

859
00:32:36,870 --> 00:32:34,399
core

860
00:32:38,389 --> 00:32:36,880
phenomena there's a there's a there's a

861
00:32:41,509 --> 00:32:38,399
the spokes on the wheel

862
00:32:43,350 --> 00:32:41,519
all join at one central

863
00:32:45,029 --> 00:32:43,360
source i don't know what that source is

864
00:32:47,750 --> 00:32:45,039
so and and the

865
00:32:48,950 --> 00:32:47,760
the it can it can show up as a nuts and

866
00:32:51,269 --> 00:32:48,960
bolts craft

867
00:32:52,789 --> 00:32:51,279
it can show up as a psychic vision it

868
00:32:53,509 --> 00:32:52,799
can show up as like as you said as an

869
00:32:57,669 --> 00:32:53,519
orb

870
00:33:00,710 --> 00:32:57,679
so um and it also can show up in like

871
00:33:02,230 --> 00:33:00,720
richly symbolic ways lots of researchers

872
00:33:05,350 --> 00:33:02,240
have recognized this that these

873
00:33:08,549 --> 00:33:05,360
experiences show up in a sort of um

874
00:33:11,110 --> 00:33:08,559
mythological fable sometimes

875
00:33:12,549 --> 00:33:11,120
in in the the elements including the

876
00:33:13,190 --> 00:33:12,559
people's reactions like death and

877
00:33:15,509 --> 00:33:13,200
rebirth

878
00:33:16,630 --> 00:33:15,519
and and spiritual awakening and things

879
00:33:20,389 --> 00:33:16,640
like that which are

880
00:33:23,830 --> 00:33:20,399
often tied into this now um

881
00:33:26,470 --> 00:33:23,840
so the answer is i simply don't know my

882
00:33:27,750 --> 00:33:26,480
sense is that there's one core source

883
00:33:30,950 --> 00:33:27,760
and it can manifest

884
00:33:33,029 --> 00:33:30,960
in innumerable ways so we might be

885
00:33:34,950 --> 00:33:33,039
seeing many many things many things

886
00:33:36,789 --> 00:33:34,960
disparate in the literature

887
00:33:38,630 --> 00:33:36,799
but if we traced it we had the ability

888
00:33:41,990 --> 00:33:38,640
to trace every event back

889
00:33:43,430 --> 00:33:42,000
we pull on every thread my

890
00:33:45,110 --> 00:33:43,440
you know partially i just hope just

891
00:33:47,110 --> 00:33:45,120
because it sounds cool but my

892
00:33:48,630 --> 00:33:47,120
my sense is that it would all trace back

893
00:33:49,669 --> 00:33:48,640
to one source and i don't know what that

894
00:33:52,470 --> 00:33:49,679
source might be

895
00:33:53,430 --> 00:33:52,480
okay well and i doubt it may or may not

896
00:33:56,789 --> 00:33:53,440
be

897
00:34:00,070 --> 00:33:56,799
from another planet i'm not sure

898
00:34:02,549 --> 00:34:00,080
about any of these things i kind of

899
00:34:03,990 --> 00:34:02,559
kind of mostly doubt that they're

900
00:34:07,110 --> 00:34:04,000
traveling from

901
00:34:07,669 --> 00:34:07,120
uh you know beta centauri to come here

902
00:34:10,470 --> 00:34:07,679
in a

903
00:34:11,589 --> 00:34:10,480
a nuts and bolts craft and that there

904
00:34:15,510 --> 00:34:11,599
may be

905
00:34:18,230 --> 00:34:15,520
some kind of uh alternative reality

906
00:34:19,030 --> 00:34:18,240
um i'm going further ahead than i had

907
00:34:22,069 --> 00:34:19,040
intended to

908
00:34:24,149 --> 00:34:22,079
at the moment with the talk with you

909
00:34:25,909 --> 00:34:24,159
but at one point you talk about the

910
00:34:29,270 --> 00:34:25,919
cosmic window idea

911
00:34:30,790 --> 00:34:29,280
and i have a similar idea and i sort of

912
00:34:33,349 --> 00:34:30,800
see it as fingers

913
00:34:33,990 --> 00:34:33,359
poking through a thick foggy material

914
00:34:37,109 --> 00:34:34,000
that we

915
00:34:39,430 --> 00:34:37,119
usually do not have access to uh what's

916
00:34:42,790 --> 00:34:39,440
beyond that thick foggy material

917
00:34:44,790 --> 00:34:42,800
but i guess my thought is that

918
00:34:47,990 --> 00:34:44,800
there could be more than one thing

919
00:34:48,950 --> 00:34:48,000
behind that thick blocky material at

920
00:34:51,669 --> 00:34:48,960
least that's

921
00:34:52,710 --> 00:34:51,679
been something of my experience so not

922
00:34:55,270 --> 00:34:52,720
for nothing i mean it

923
00:34:57,670 --> 00:34:55,280
we don't have to like uh have a a

924
00:35:00,630 --> 00:34:57,680
doctrinaire party line here but i just

925
00:35:02,790 --> 00:35:00,640
put that out there and i i was very

926
00:35:03,430 --> 00:35:02,800
impressed by the cosmic window idea

927
00:35:07,109 --> 00:35:03,440
because it

928
00:35:10,150 --> 00:35:07,119
is similar to my my you know

929
00:35:11,510 --> 00:35:10,160
inner feelings about a thick foggy

930
00:35:13,349 --> 00:35:11,520
material that

931
00:35:15,270 --> 00:35:13,359
every once in a while a finger pokes

932
00:35:16,710 --> 00:35:15,280
through there and you get a glimpse of

933
00:35:20,950 --> 00:35:16,720
what's going on

934
00:35:22,069 --> 00:35:20,960
uh but let's talk about one thing that

935
00:35:25,270 --> 00:35:22,079
you've mentioned

936
00:35:28,470 --> 00:35:25,280
several times through your books and

937
00:35:31,589 --> 00:35:28,480
uh that is the primal

938
00:35:35,030 --> 00:35:31,599
fear of experiencers of

939
00:35:38,630 --> 00:35:35,040
the quote-unquote ufo

940
00:35:43,109 --> 00:35:38,640
experience that other things

941
00:35:46,790 --> 00:35:43,119
such as synchronicities and even

942
00:35:48,530 --> 00:35:46,800
animal sightings of other sorts

943
00:35:49,910 --> 00:35:48,540
don't seem to

944
00:35:53,190 --> 00:35:49,920
[Music]

945
00:35:56,870 --> 00:35:53,200
cause all right this primal

946
00:35:58,390 --> 00:35:56,880
fear and um i think that there a number

947
00:36:01,910 --> 00:35:58,400
of people have spoken

948
00:36:04,950 --> 00:36:01,920
about it i have spoken to

949
00:36:08,230 --> 00:36:04,960
um chase kletsky about it

950
00:36:09,190 --> 00:36:08,240
and i've heard whitley strieber talk

951
00:36:12,710 --> 00:36:09,200
about it and

952
00:36:15,910 --> 00:36:12,720
i have experienced it uh

953
00:36:19,349 --> 00:36:15,920
when i have found that the

954
00:36:24,310 --> 00:36:19,359
others were around me in some way

955
00:36:27,349 --> 00:36:24,320
in my home when i felt like i was being

956
00:36:28,950 --> 00:36:27,359
taken away if you will

957
00:36:30,069 --> 00:36:28,960
and i have felt it too there's a section

958
00:36:31,589 --> 00:36:30,079
at the end of the first book where i

959
00:36:33,030 --> 00:36:31,599
talk about an event that took place

960
00:36:34,710 --> 00:36:33,040
where i was in a tent with a friend of

961
00:36:37,910 --> 00:36:34,720
mine her name was natasha

962
00:36:41,030 --> 00:36:37,920
and both of us woke up screaming

963
00:36:44,550 --> 00:36:41,040
uh and it was simultaneous

964
00:36:46,310 --> 00:36:44,560
like boom we were we were thrust into

965
00:36:48,630 --> 00:36:46,320
the way i refer to it as a synthetic

966
00:36:50,790 --> 00:36:48,640
fear where it seems like

967
00:36:51,670 --> 00:36:50,800
like it's irrational to sum it up in

968
00:36:55,190 --> 00:36:51,680
kind of normal

969
00:36:57,829 --> 00:36:55,200
primal ways it felt like it was

970
00:36:58,950 --> 00:36:57,839
projected onto us or into us if that

971
00:37:00,710 --> 00:36:58,960
makes sense

972
00:37:02,390 --> 00:37:00,720
um i've heard some people talk about the

973
00:37:05,670 --> 00:37:02,400
fact that like perhaps these

974
00:37:08,790 --> 00:37:05,680
beings and there was so there was

975
00:37:10,790 --> 00:37:08,800
so that event in the tent um culminated

976
00:37:12,950 --> 00:37:10,800
with us being totally freaked out

977
00:37:15,109 --> 00:37:12,960
terrified for maybe

978
00:37:17,349 --> 00:37:15,119
10 minutes or less and then click we

979
00:37:19,109 --> 00:37:17,359
both went to sleep which is very unusual

980
00:37:21,349 --> 00:37:19,119
and that to me is very surprising i mean

981
00:37:22,950 --> 00:37:21,359
we sharp we that we were so

982
00:37:24,470 --> 00:37:22,960
our parts were pounding so hard both of

983
00:37:27,589 --> 00:37:24,480
us still the same thing she

984
00:37:29,829 --> 00:37:27,599
um she says it's she describes it as the

985
00:37:32,230 --> 00:37:29,839
deepest level of hell

986
00:37:35,109 --> 00:37:32,240
yes so um and i described it as

987
00:37:36,630 --> 00:37:35,119
synthetic fear and

988
00:37:37,829 --> 00:37:36,640
so i don't know this and then and then

989
00:37:39,109 --> 00:37:37,839
there was a bunch of things that

990
00:37:41,990 --> 00:37:39,119
happened

991
00:37:44,390 --> 00:37:42,000
afterwards that certainly sound like the

992
00:37:46,069 --> 00:37:44,400
elements of a ufo abduction event

993
00:37:48,310 --> 00:37:46,079
um i felt like i was floated out of the

994
00:37:49,670 --> 00:37:48,320
tent i was in a white realm i was saying

995
00:37:49,990 --> 00:37:49,680
as i was floating up i said i have to

996
00:37:56,150 --> 00:37:50,000
remember

997
00:37:57,829 --> 00:37:56,160
i actually changed the mantra to am i on

998
00:37:59,910 --> 00:37:57,839
a table am i on a table

999
00:38:01,750 --> 00:37:59,920
and then it felt like i was in this

1000
00:38:04,069 --> 00:38:01,760
white endless

1001
00:38:05,190 --> 00:38:04,079
realm i didn't that's all i can that's

1002
00:38:05,750 --> 00:38:05,200
the only memory i have and then it was

1003
00:38:07,349 --> 00:38:05,760
like

1004
00:38:08,630 --> 00:38:07,359
i was back in the tent and i don't

1005
00:38:09,829 --> 00:38:08,640
remember going back i don't remember

1006
00:38:11,270 --> 00:38:09,839
anything i just remember that was my

1007
00:38:12,950 --> 00:38:11,280
sense was just like

1008
00:38:14,790 --> 00:38:12,960
like it just was like bam like in one

1009
00:38:17,829 --> 00:38:14,800
second i was back in the tent

1010
00:38:19,670 --> 00:38:17,839
and um and the next morning i had a very

1011
00:38:20,710 --> 00:38:19,680
unusual scratch on myself and i actually

1012
00:38:22,230 --> 00:38:20,720
remember getting up the next morning

1013
00:38:24,470 --> 00:38:22,240
walking around it was totally like this

1014
00:38:25,670 --> 00:38:24,480
lovely was colorado it was this lovely

1015
00:38:26,310 --> 00:38:25,680
beautiful morning i was walking around

1016
00:38:28,390 --> 00:38:26,320
the tent like

1017
00:38:29,829 --> 00:38:28,400
looking for the burn mark in the ground

1018
00:38:31,510 --> 00:38:29,839
i didn't find anything

1019
00:38:33,349 --> 00:38:31,520
um everything seemed totally normal we

1020
00:38:35,430 --> 00:38:33,359
were both we were both kind of shocked

1021
00:38:36,950 --> 00:38:35,440
at how

1022
00:38:39,670 --> 00:38:36,960
kind of nonplussed we were about the

1023
00:38:41,190 --> 00:38:39,680
whole thing so yes that primal fear is

1024
00:38:44,069 --> 00:38:41,200
something that i've heard

1025
00:38:46,550 --> 00:38:44,079
many people discuss um i've talked to

1026
00:38:49,670 --> 00:38:46,560
chase klesky about her event also

1027
00:38:53,430 --> 00:38:49,680
my point in that is

1028
00:38:58,150 --> 00:38:53,440
simply to say that these

1029
00:39:01,270 --> 00:38:58,160
sort of contact or abduction experiences

1030
00:39:04,470 --> 00:39:01,280
which include the presence

1031
00:39:07,910 --> 00:39:04,480
one feels the presence of alien entities

1032
00:39:12,069 --> 00:39:07,920
causes this extraordinary

1033
00:39:14,390 --> 00:39:12,079
fear and sometimes we are paralyzed

1034
00:39:16,550 --> 00:39:14,400
although our eyes are open and we are

1035
00:39:19,910 --> 00:39:16,560
aware of our surroundings and

1036
00:39:23,710 --> 00:39:19,920
i've fought those things many times

1037
00:39:26,870 --> 00:39:23,720
and do have other sorts of shamanic

1038
00:39:27,190 --> 00:39:26,880
experiences that do not cause that kind

1039
00:39:30,550 --> 00:39:27,200
of

1040
00:39:31,990 --> 00:39:30,560
thing so we have to say look at that in

1041
00:39:34,230 --> 00:39:32,000
a way for instance

1042
00:39:36,550 --> 00:39:34,240
sometimes when there's a ufo sighting

1043
00:39:37,829 --> 00:39:36,560
the dogs go wild in the neighborhood

1044
00:39:40,069 --> 00:39:37,839
right they

1045
00:39:41,109 --> 00:39:40,079
like they freak out and they're totally

1046
00:39:43,589 --> 00:39:41,119
going wild

1047
00:39:44,790 --> 00:39:43,599
i'm just making a slight case for

1048
00:39:47,750 --> 00:39:44,800
somehow

1049
00:39:49,030 --> 00:39:47,760
the actual presence of the alien

1050
00:39:51,670 --> 00:39:49,040
entities alien

1051
00:39:52,069 --> 00:39:51,680
could mean anything it doesn't mean to

1052
00:39:55,270 --> 00:39:52,079
me

1053
00:39:59,190 --> 00:39:55,280
necessarily outer space entities alien

1054
00:40:02,230 --> 00:39:59,200
meaning not us so

1055
00:40:04,309 --> 00:40:02,240
going further into that

1056
00:40:06,550 --> 00:40:04,319
it can be so traumatic to the

1057
00:40:07,910 --> 00:40:06,560
experiencer that their sanity would be

1058
00:40:09,829 --> 00:40:07,920
in jeopardy

1059
00:40:11,750 --> 00:40:09,839
and i think that is something that you

1060
00:40:15,190 --> 00:40:11,760
wrote and something that i

1061
00:40:18,069 --> 00:40:15,200
feel intrinsically is true

1062
00:40:19,349 --> 00:40:18,079
yes you speak to that a little yeah i

1063
00:40:22,470 --> 00:40:19,359
mean so and i

1064
00:40:25,750 --> 00:40:22,480
um i mean i

1065
00:40:27,109 --> 00:40:25,760
feel like i spent so that as i mean as

1066
00:40:28,390 --> 00:40:27,119
far as the fear thing yes

1067
00:40:30,150 --> 00:40:28,400
my sanity was in jeopardy you know what

1068
00:40:32,069 --> 00:40:30,160
it felt like it felt like my soul

1069
00:40:33,670 --> 00:40:32,079
was in jeopardy it felt like it felt

1070
00:40:37,190 --> 00:40:33,680
like like

1071
00:40:38,470 --> 00:40:37,200
my soul was was

1072
00:40:41,030 --> 00:40:38,480
like a breath away from being

1073
00:40:44,470 --> 00:40:41,040
extinguished it was that kind of primal

1074
00:40:45,990 --> 00:40:44,480
yes intensity and then it just turned

1075
00:40:47,430 --> 00:40:46,000
off and we were both kind of normal that

1076
00:40:48,550 --> 00:40:47,440
was red that was actually more shocking

1077
00:40:53,829 --> 00:40:48,560
than anything

1078
00:40:56,150 --> 00:40:53,839
um so uh

1079
00:40:57,829 --> 00:40:56,160
so here's a story this this is uh this

1080
00:40:59,750 --> 00:40:57,839
is she has not given me permission to

1081
00:41:01,990 --> 00:40:59,760
share the story so i'll just i won't

1082
00:41:02,870 --> 00:41:02,000
give all the details a close friend of

1083
00:41:04,470 --> 00:41:02,880
mine

1084
00:41:06,309 --> 00:41:04,480
heard my research and mentioned that it

1085
00:41:07,430 --> 00:41:06,319
was that raccoons

1086
00:41:09,030 --> 00:41:07,440
were one of the things that people

1087
00:41:10,550 --> 00:41:09,040
report sometimes in screen memories and

1088
00:41:11,589 --> 00:41:10,560
she was very upset because she had an

1089
00:41:14,550 --> 00:41:11,599
experience

1090
00:41:15,670 --> 00:41:14,560
where she she's young and healthy and

1091
00:41:18,950 --> 00:41:15,680
she must have been

1092
00:41:21,430 --> 00:41:18,960
in her early 30s um

1093
00:41:23,829 --> 00:41:21,440
looked out her back door there was some

1094
00:41:25,430 --> 00:41:23,839
raccoons on the back porch

1095
00:41:27,109 --> 00:41:25,440
and then she the next thing she knows

1096
00:41:28,390 --> 00:41:27,119
she's paralyzed she thought she was

1097
00:41:29,270 --> 00:41:28,400
having a stroke she thought she was

1098
00:41:31,510 --> 00:41:29,280
dying

1099
00:41:32,470 --> 00:41:31,520
she was totally paralyzed and it

1100
00:41:34,550 --> 00:41:32,480
terrified her

1101
00:41:36,309 --> 00:41:34,560
she came out of the peril is paralyzed

1102
00:41:37,430 --> 00:41:36,319
thing and she immediately called an

1103
00:41:39,589 --> 00:41:37,440
ambulance

1104
00:41:40,470 --> 00:41:39,599
and and like they took her to the

1105
00:41:44,309 --> 00:41:40,480
emergency room

1106
00:41:46,150 --> 00:41:44,319
she was so freaked out

1107
00:41:47,430 --> 00:41:46,160
um they there was nothing wrong with

1108
00:41:50,950 --> 00:41:47,440
there was nothing at all

1109
00:41:55,109 --> 00:41:50,960
so that's a very telling story indeed

1110
00:41:56,950 --> 00:41:55,119
yeah so that here so we haven't so

1111
00:41:58,230 --> 00:41:56,960
if the raccoons weren't raccoons then

1112
00:41:58,630 --> 00:41:58,240
they would have been some sort of screen

1113
00:42:01,190 --> 00:41:58,640
memory

1114
00:42:03,190 --> 00:42:01,200
right and perhaps under hypnosis you

1115
00:42:04,950 --> 00:42:03,200
know she would have described the

1116
00:42:06,230 --> 00:42:04,960
i can't say but i'm just speculating

1117
00:42:09,829 --> 00:42:06,240
perhaps under hypnosis

1118
00:42:10,470 --> 00:42:09,839
she might describe the um the raccoons

1119
00:42:12,390 --> 00:42:10,480
as

1120
00:42:13,910 --> 00:42:12,400
you know skinny with bald heads and big

1121
00:42:16,309 --> 00:42:13,920
black eyes and

1122
00:42:17,190 --> 00:42:16,319
and they're probably not raccoons yes

1123
00:42:20,309 --> 00:42:17,200
yes i've had

1124
00:42:23,510 --> 00:42:20,319
my own little raccoon issues

1125
00:42:26,790 --> 00:42:23,520
um where um i

1126
00:42:29,349 --> 00:42:26,800
saw a very large raccoon at

1127
00:42:29,990 --> 00:42:29,359
the head of a driveway at the top of a

1128
00:42:34,870 --> 00:42:30,000
driveway

1129
00:42:37,750 --> 00:42:34,880
going up a hill and i said to myself

1130
00:42:40,069 --> 00:42:37,760
looked at it's not a small bear it

1131
00:42:43,190 --> 00:42:40,079
definitely looks like a raccoon

1132
00:42:46,870 --> 00:42:43,200
but it's way too large to be a raccoon

1133
00:42:48,550 --> 00:42:46,880
and um in the same time frame not the

1134
00:42:52,630 --> 00:42:48,560
same day or

1135
00:42:56,790 --> 00:42:52,640
anything there was a cat

1136
00:43:00,710 --> 00:42:56,800
who was a feral cat that was being fed

1137
00:43:04,069 --> 00:43:00,720
and um on easter day

1138
00:43:07,190 --> 00:43:04,079
i'm going to say three or four years ago

1139
00:43:10,870 --> 00:43:07,200
um that feral cat was on

1140
00:43:14,550 --> 00:43:10,880
the front porch of this house that i

1141
00:43:18,630 --> 00:43:14,560
was visiting and um

1142
00:43:22,150 --> 00:43:18,640
that feral cat had a marsupial friend

1143
00:43:24,950 --> 00:43:22,160
a possum that sat on that front porch

1144
00:43:26,790 --> 00:43:24,960
with that cat for whatever reason i

1145
00:43:30,150 --> 00:43:26,800
can't even go there

1146
00:43:35,030 --> 00:43:30,160
but um he did and he was being fed

1147
00:43:39,190 --> 00:43:35,040
and in broad daylight a raccoon

1148
00:43:42,390 --> 00:43:39,200
came up and bit the the feral cat

1149
00:43:44,150 --> 00:43:42,400
now i sort of saw now this is my own

1150
00:43:45,030 --> 00:43:44,160
interpretation it might be wrong or

1151
00:43:48,390 --> 00:43:45,040
right

1152
00:43:51,430 --> 00:43:48,400
i sort of saw the cat as a

1153
00:43:54,710 --> 00:43:51,440
a watcher for the building

1154
00:43:58,790 --> 00:43:54,720
that that home the feral cat was

1155
00:44:01,990 --> 00:43:58,800
sort of like a guardian and that

1156
00:44:05,589 --> 00:44:02,000
raccoon attacked that

1157
00:44:07,589 --> 00:44:05,599
cat now it's very unusual for a raccoon

1158
00:44:11,109 --> 00:44:07,599
who is not

1159
00:44:14,470 --> 00:44:11,119
um who was not rabid to be out

1160
00:44:16,950 --> 00:44:14,480
during the day and uh the cat

1161
00:44:18,150 --> 00:44:16,960
was checked and the cat did not have

1162
00:44:21,589 --> 00:44:18,160
rabies

1163
00:44:22,790 --> 00:44:21,599
but the cat lasted oh maybe perhaps a

1164
00:44:25,589 --> 00:44:22,800
year longer or

1165
00:44:26,870 --> 00:44:25,599
six months longer and did in fact die of

1166
00:44:30,309 --> 00:44:26,880
other things

1167
00:44:33,990 --> 00:44:30,319
but um i kind of felt like that was an

1168
00:44:37,510 --> 00:44:34,000
uncanny raccoon experience

1169
00:44:38,309 --> 00:44:37,520
but no no terror on my part but the poor

1170
00:44:40,230 --> 00:44:38,319
cat

1171
00:44:41,670 --> 00:44:40,240
bit in the middle of the day by the

1172
00:44:43,829 --> 00:44:41,680
raccoon

1173
00:44:45,510 --> 00:44:43,839
yeah with a with a possum there now also

1174
00:44:46,950 --> 00:44:45,520
one key one small little point here

1175
00:44:48,630 --> 00:44:46,960
which i pay attention to is it was on

1176
00:44:51,030 --> 00:44:48,640
easter sunday which is a very

1177
00:44:53,430 --> 00:44:51,040
the highly charged day in the calendar

1178
00:44:55,750 --> 00:44:53,440
yes i mean that is a that's a day of

1179
00:44:56,790 --> 00:44:55,760
ascension that's what that's a day when

1180
00:45:00,069 --> 00:44:56,800
like

1181
00:45:03,589 --> 00:45:00,079
you know ascending into heaven yes

1182
00:45:07,750 --> 00:45:03,599
so yes it is it was a charged day

1183
00:45:08,470 --> 00:45:07,760
and it was someone saw the owl attacking

1184
00:45:11,349 --> 00:45:08,480
the cat

1185
00:45:12,710 --> 00:45:11,359
and as a result of having seen it out

1186
00:45:16,309 --> 00:45:12,720
the window somehow

1187
00:45:17,270 --> 00:45:16,319
sitting in a dining room they were able

1188
00:45:19,510 --> 00:45:17,280
to

1189
00:45:20,870 --> 00:45:19,520
scare the raccoon away or open the door

1190
00:45:24,069 --> 00:45:20,880
and um

1191
00:45:27,270 --> 00:45:24,079
disengage the cat and the raccoon from

1192
00:45:30,150 --> 00:45:27,280
one killing the other so that's just

1193
00:45:31,430 --> 00:45:30,160
a little a little bit there but no that

1194
00:45:32,710 --> 00:45:31,440
would this is where you get the sh this

1195
00:45:34,470 --> 00:45:32,720
is where the shaman has to come in you

1196
00:45:36,390 --> 00:45:34,480
know like we know where does these totem

1197
00:45:38,550 --> 00:45:36,400
animal experiences these

1198
00:45:40,309 --> 00:45:38,560
you know and i guess sometimes normal

1199
00:45:42,470 --> 00:45:40,319
things can happen with owls and cats and

1200
00:45:43,190 --> 00:45:42,480
raccoons and and possums and things like

1201
00:45:45,750 --> 00:45:43,200
that but

1202
00:45:47,510 --> 00:45:45,760
sometimes there's a can i tell a story

1203
00:45:48,870 --> 00:45:47,520
sure please so here's so here's a so

1204
00:45:49,510 --> 00:45:48,880
easter sunday it's an easter sunday

1205
00:45:52,550 --> 00:45:49,520
story

1206
00:45:52,870 --> 00:45:52,560
um a woman is named susan kornacki she's

1207
00:45:54,550 --> 00:45:52,880
been

1208
00:45:57,690 --> 00:45:54,560
out and vocal and talking about her

1209
00:45:58,829 --> 00:45:57,700
experiences she

1210
00:46:01,750 --> 00:45:58,839
[Music]

1211
00:46:03,990 --> 00:46:01,760
um she was

1212
00:46:05,109 --> 00:46:04,000
at an easter party easter sunday she was

1213
00:46:07,829 --> 00:46:05,119
with her husband and

1214
00:46:09,270 --> 00:46:07,839
daughter and an event took place where

1215
00:46:10,710 --> 00:46:09,280
she was just like oh my goodness and all

1216
00:46:12,150 --> 00:46:10,720
of a sudden she felt this energy

1217
00:46:14,550 --> 00:46:12,160
rushing up and down her spine and she

1218
00:46:15,990 --> 00:46:14,560
said it felt like a tesla coil going off

1219
00:46:18,069 --> 00:46:16,000
and she said something's going on i'm

1220
00:46:19,270 --> 00:46:18,079
freaking out i gotta get out of here

1221
00:46:20,710 --> 00:46:19,280
i'm gonna go home can you take the kids

1222
00:46:21,910 --> 00:46:20,720
home and you know meet me later so she

1223
00:46:24,309 --> 00:46:21,920
left the easter party

1224
00:46:25,270 --> 00:46:24,319
went to her homes easter it's a spring

1225
00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:25,280
day it's in

1226
00:46:29,109 --> 00:46:28,400
um massachusetts so she goes to the

1227
00:46:31,910 --> 00:46:29,119
backyard to

1228
00:46:33,109 --> 00:46:31,920
to relax and just try to try to you know

1229
00:46:34,630 --> 00:46:33,119
get her wits again

1230
00:46:36,630 --> 00:46:34,640
and she lays in her hammock as soon as

1231
00:46:37,990 --> 00:46:36,640
she gets in her hammock an owl lands on

1232
00:46:40,950 --> 00:46:38,000
one branch

1233
00:46:42,230 --> 00:46:40,960
of the one tree and then the other tree

1234
00:46:43,589 --> 00:46:42,240
that the hammock is connected to it's

1235
00:46:44,630 --> 00:46:43,599
connected between two trees and our

1236
00:46:46,230 --> 00:46:44,640
lands in the other one

1237
00:46:49,109 --> 00:46:46,240
and these two owls start hooting at each

1238
00:46:51,430 --> 00:46:49,119
other and she's in the middle

1239
00:46:53,270 --> 00:46:51,440
and she feels like this energy like

1240
00:46:54,950 --> 00:46:53,280
surging through her body

1241
00:46:56,870 --> 00:46:54,960
she said it felt like she was being

1242
00:46:58,710 --> 00:46:56,880
recalibrated

1243
00:47:00,230 --> 00:46:58,720
i can't help but think of like a circuit

1244
00:47:02,069 --> 00:47:00,240
board you know like a

1245
00:47:03,270 --> 00:47:02,079
and in these components you know these

1246
00:47:03,829 --> 00:47:03,280
two little components this little

1247
00:47:05,829 --> 00:47:03,839
component

1248
00:47:07,670 --> 00:47:05,839
this susan is in the middle of these two

1249
00:47:09,190 --> 00:47:07,680
owls and they're all rigged together

1250
00:47:12,309 --> 00:47:09,200
with the trees and the hammock and

1251
00:47:14,150 --> 00:47:12,319
there's she's being recalibrated

1252
00:47:15,270 --> 00:47:14,160
um eventually her husband came home and

1253
00:47:16,150 --> 00:47:15,280
said how you feeling and she said what

1254
00:47:17,270 --> 00:47:16,160
do you notice

1255
00:47:18,390 --> 00:47:17,280
he said well there's an owl in that

1256
00:47:19,430 --> 00:47:18,400
branch and there's an owl and that

1257
00:47:20,309 --> 00:47:19,440
branch and that tree over there and

1258
00:47:21,030 --> 00:47:20,319
they're hooting at each other and she

1259
00:47:24,549 --> 00:47:21,040
says uh-huh

1260
00:47:25,990 --> 00:47:24,559
uh-huh and then afterwards

1261
00:47:28,230 --> 00:47:26,000
she had had some premonitions about this

1262
00:47:30,710 --> 00:47:28,240
and i'm i'm not sure

1263
00:47:32,230 --> 00:47:30,720
but afterwards she started doing healing

1264
00:47:34,390 --> 00:47:32,240
hands-on healing she doesn't call it

1265
00:47:37,829 --> 00:47:34,400
reiki she calls it hands-on healing

1266
00:47:39,990 --> 00:47:37,839
and this is very this is

1267
00:47:41,109 --> 00:47:40,000
this is the kind of story that that i

1268
00:47:44,630 --> 00:47:41,119
i'm drawn to

1269
00:47:46,150 --> 00:47:44,640
these very strange symbolic stories like

1270
00:47:47,910 --> 00:47:46,160
this easter sunday

1271
00:47:49,510 --> 00:47:47,920
um you know i asked her do you think it

1272
00:47:50,230 --> 00:47:49,520
was a kundalini awakening she said no i

1273
00:47:51,670 --> 00:47:50,240
don't think so

1274
00:47:53,430 --> 00:47:51,680
but that's kind of what she was

1275
00:47:56,069 --> 00:47:53,440
describing um

1276
00:47:56,870 --> 00:47:56,079
you know the energy surge upper spine

1277
00:47:59,349 --> 00:47:56,880
yes

1278
00:48:00,150 --> 00:47:59,359
it does sound like a kundalini awakening

1279
00:48:01,910 --> 00:48:00,160
to me

1280
00:48:03,430 --> 00:48:01,920
uh but sometimes these things aren't

1281
00:48:05,829 --> 00:48:03,440
complete that yeah

1282
00:48:07,190 --> 00:48:05,839
you know they don't so it's quite quite

1283
00:48:10,470 --> 00:48:07,200
amazing and to become

1284
00:48:13,910 --> 00:48:10,480
a hands-on healer uh of course is uh

1285
00:48:18,150 --> 00:48:13,920
a wonderful place to take this energy

1286
00:48:21,990 --> 00:48:18,160
to i believe yes i agree

1287
00:48:24,309 --> 00:48:22,000
so um do you have anything else to say

1288
00:48:27,750 --> 00:48:24,319
about the idea that

1289
00:48:30,870 --> 00:48:27,760
that people's sanity uh

1290
00:48:33,750 --> 00:48:30,880
could be in jeopardy from

1291
00:48:33,990 --> 00:48:33,760
the presence of these entities because

1292
00:48:36,309 --> 00:48:34,000
this

1293
00:48:38,870 --> 00:48:36,319
is something that is extremely

1294
00:48:40,230 --> 00:48:38,880
interesting to me

1295
00:48:42,150 --> 00:48:40,240
you know i would i'm trying to think of

1296
00:48:45,270 --> 00:48:42,160
a case you know so i

1297
00:48:46,790 --> 00:48:45,280
i mean this is the this is the how to

1298
00:48:48,309 --> 00:48:46,800
say it like if someone hikes goes up to

1299
00:48:49,990 --> 00:48:48,319
the top of mount olympus back in ancient

1300
00:48:51,030 --> 00:48:50,000
greece and like meets the gods right

1301
00:48:51,670 --> 00:48:51,040
they're going to come down they're going

1302
00:48:54,950 --> 00:48:51,680
to be

1303
00:48:56,790 --> 00:48:54,960
you just see them with like their pairs

1304
00:48:58,950 --> 00:48:56,800
like blown back in the wild look in

1305
00:49:00,470 --> 00:48:58,960
their eyes yes yeah i mean that's the

1306
00:49:08,390 --> 00:49:00,480
that's the

1307
00:49:11,270 --> 00:49:08,400
i mean so so i think of myself when i

1308
00:49:11,750 --> 00:49:11,280
and so between 2006 when i had that

1309
00:49:14,150 --> 00:49:11,760
event

1310
00:49:14,870 --> 00:49:14,160
in the mountains where i saw those owls

1311
00:49:18,230 --> 00:49:14,880
and about

1312
00:49:21,910 --> 00:49:18,240
2011. i

1313
00:49:22,870 --> 00:49:21,920
that's five years i i've said this

1314
00:49:26,230 --> 00:49:22,880
publicly

1315
00:49:28,230 --> 00:49:26,240
i felt like i spent 95

1316
00:49:29,750 --> 00:49:28,240
of my waking hours wondering if i had

1317
00:49:33,190 --> 00:49:29,760
gone insane

1318
00:49:36,790 --> 00:49:33,200
and that is not an exaggeration um

1319
00:49:40,230 --> 00:49:38,150
you know i was i mean i was in the

1320
00:49:40,710 --> 00:49:40,240
presence of powerful synchronicities yes

1321
00:49:43,990 --> 00:49:40,720
so i

1322
00:49:47,670 --> 00:49:44,000
so there's a i'm certain that

1323
00:49:48,950 --> 00:49:47,680
that that these experiences whether

1324
00:49:50,150 --> 00:49:48,960
simply the presence you know i heard at

1325
00:49:51,510 --> 00:49:50,160
one time described that they're

1326
00:49:52,950 --> 00:49:51,520
like basically they're on a different

1327
00:49:54,309 --> 00:49:52,960
vibration than us they're from some

1328
00:49:54,870 --> 00:49:54,319
other reality they're from some of the

1329
00:49:56,470 --> 00:49:54,880
realm

1330
00:49:58,069 --> 00:49:56,480
they arrive here they're vibrating

1331
00:50:00,069 --> 00:49:58,079
differently i don't know and

1332
00:50:02,309 --> 00:50:00,079
and so just being in the mere presence

1333
00:50:03,270 --> 00:50:02,319
of something from an alternate reality

1334
00:50:05,190 --> 00:50:03,280
that's just not

1335
00:50:06,549 --> 00:50:05,200
in sync with our vibrations i'm using

1336
00:50:07,670 --> 00:50:06,559
terms that that

1337
00:50:09,990 --> 00:50:07,680
that i don't know i'm probably

1338
00:50:10,630 --> 00:50:10,000
explaining incorrectly but that is my

1339
00:50:12,470 --> 00:50:10,640
sense

1340
00:50:14,230 --> 00:50:12,480
i don't think you're explaining it

1341
00:50:15,190 --> 00:50:14,240
incorrectly i think you're explaining it

1342
00:50:16,870 --> 00:50:15,200
correctly

1343
00:50:18,390 --> 00:50:16,880
because there are vibrations in the

1344
00:50:21,030 --> 00:50:18,400
contact experience

1345
00:50:22,390 --> 00:50:21,040
there are vibrations and sleep paralysis

1346
00:50:25,670 --> 00:50:22,400
there are vibrations

1347
00:50:27,270 --> 00:50:25,680
in the epileptic migrant disorder

1348
00:50:29,430 --> 00:50:27,280
and there are vibrations in the

1349
00:50:31,829 --> 00:50:29,440
kundalini awakening

1350
00:50:33,750 --> 00:50:31,839
and i get different kinds of vibrations

1351
00:50:35,829 --> 00:50:33,760
when i go to the monroe institute and

1352
00:50:38,870 --> 00:50:35,839
use their hemising technology

1353
00:50:40,309 --> 00:50:38,880
to meditate i sort of run energy through

1354
00:50:44,150 --> 00:50:40,319
my body and it

1355
00:50:47,190 --> 00:50:44,160
is doable and it is not in itself

1356
00:50:49,109 --> 00:50:47,200
horrifying or terrifying but when you

1357
00:50:50,309 --> 00:50:49,119
have the vibration in the contact

1358
00:50:54,230 --> 00:50:50,319
experience

1359
00:50:57,190 --> 00:50:54,240
that is uh you know the average person i

1360
00:50:59,910 --> 00:50:57,200
put myself in that category in this case

1361
00:51:01,349 --> 00:50:59,920
tries to fight it at all costs it

1362
00:51:06,069 --> 00:51:01,359
because of this

1363
00:51:08,630 --> 00:51:06,079
this horrible primal fear factor

1364
00:51:11,750 --> 00:51:08,640
and yes yes i did not know so you i have

1365
00:51:14,870 --> 00:51:11,760
here can i tell a a story about the um

1366
00:51:15,109 --> 00:51:14,880
uh the hemisync tapes sure sure so this

1367
00:51:18,309 --> 00:51:15,119
is

1368
00:51:21,349 --> 00:51:18,319
um i had an experience in

1369
00:51:24,230 --> 00:51:21,359
uh 2013

1370
00:51:24,870 --> 00:51:24,240
where i slept outside and i saw a what i

1371
00:51:27,030 --> 00:51:24,880
thought was a

1372
00:51:28,309 --> 00:51:27,040
landed flying saucer on a hilltop and i

1373
00:51:29,510 --> 00:51:28,319
just laid there and i rolled over went

1374
00:51:30,790 --> 00:51:29,520
back to sleep and said that's some big

1375
00:51:33,109 --> 00:51:30,800
house and then i went back to the site

1376
00:51:36,069 --> 00:51:33,119
later and there's no big house there

1377
00:51:37,109 --> 00:51:36,079
so so i i that bugged me and it was you

1378
00:51:39,190 --> 00:51:37,119
know what was interesting about that

1379
00:51:40,549 --> 00:51:39,200
that event there was no fear associated

1380
00:51:41,829 --> 00:51:40,559
with it all everything about that whole

1381
00:51:43,430 --> 00:51:41,839
thing was pleasant

1382
00:51:44,710 --> 00:51:43,440
it was a beautiful night the stars were

1383
00:51:45,589 --> 00:51:44,720
beautiful i was sleeping in southern

1384
00:51:47,750 --> 00:51:45,599
utah

1385
00:51:49,589 --> 00:51:47,760
and i was sleeping outside alone and and

1386
00:51:52,630 --> 00:51:49,599
i heard a coyote near my head

1387
00:51:54,549 --> 00:51:52,640
which is as close as any

1388
00:51:55,990 --> 00:51:54,559
it was so close i don't understand why i

1389
00:51:58,230 --> 00:51:56,000
didn't see it

1390
00:51:59,270 --> 00:51:58,240
and that it was loud and it woke me up

1391
00:52:01,670 --> 00:51:59,280
so there's like a

1392
00:52:02,309 --> 00:52:01,680
there's like totem animal a coyote and i

1393
00:52:04,950 --> 00:52:02,319
was in

1394
00:52:05,589 --> 00:52:04,960
a trickster waking me up and then

1395
00:52:10,710 --> 00:52:05,599
there's a

1396
00:52:12,710 --> 00:52:10,720
i also saw a light behind a bush now

1397
00:52:13,190 --> 00:52:12,720
there's another sort of biblical imagery

1398
00:52:15,109 --> 00:52:13,200
there

1399
00:52:16,549 --> 00:52:15,119
the same night mike the same night the

1400
00:52:19,670 --> 00:52:16,559
same night then so

1401
00:52:21,190 --> 00:52:19,680
and i and i and i i

1402
00:52:23,430 --> 00:52:21,200
rarely meditate every once in a while i

1403
00:52:26,549 --> 00:52:23,440
will and i and i like the the um

1404
00:52:27,910 --> 00:52:26,559
hemi sync tapes with robert monroe's

1405
00:52:28,950 --> 00:52:27,920
voice he's got this kind of radio

1406
00:52:31,190 --> 00:52:28,960
announcer voice yes

1407
00:52:32,230 --> 00:52:31,200
and he says you know he's leading the

1408
00:52:36,470 --> 00:52:32,240
the uh

1409
00:52:37,670 --> 00:52:36,480
like take your troubles and put them in

1410
00:52:39,190 --> 00:52:37,680
a big heavy box

1411
00:52:41,190 --> 00:52:39,200
you won't be needing them for the length

1412
00:52:42,790 --> 00:52:41,200
of your of your session

1413
00:52:44,549 --> 00:52:42,800
and so and then also he's just he's

1414
00:52:45,990 --> 00:52:44,559
talking and he says and now take the

1415
00:52:47,589 --> 00:52:46,000
fingers of your right hand

1416
00:52:49,109 --> 00:52:47,599
and press them to your forehead when you

1417
00:52:50,870 --> 00:52:49,119
touch your forehead the

1418
00:52:52,150 --> 00:52:50,880
the issue at hand will be revealed and

1419
00:52:53,510 --> 00:52:52,160
i'm like sitting there in my living room

1420
00:52:55,510 --> 00:52:53,520
i got a little meditation stool i'm as

1421
00:52:57,270 --> 00:52:55,520
calm as can be it's just

1422
00:52:58,950 --> 00:52:57,280
you know and i just i'm in the sunshine

1423
00:53:00,069 --> 00:52:58,960
it's warm and he says take the fingers

1424
00:53:01,750 --> 00:53:00,079
of your right hand

1425
00:53:03,589 --> 00:53:01,760
touch your forehead and the issues at

1426
00:53:04,870 --> 00:53:03,599
hand will be revealed i just touched my

1427
00:53:07,990 --> 00:53:04,880
forward and bam

1428
00:53:11,349 --> 00:53:08,000
i get the electric image

1429
00:53:15,030 --> 00:53:11,359
clear as a bell of

1430
00:53:16,870 --> 00:53:15,040
me lying on the ground at that site

1431
00:53:18,069 --> 00:53:16,880
in utah where i saw the round thing on

1432
00:53:21,030 --> 00:53:18,079
the on the hilltop

1433
00:53:22,390 --> 00:53:21,040
and i am surrounded by gray aliens

1434
00:53:25,510 --> 00:53:22,400
standing in a circle around me

1435
00:53:27,829 --> 00:53:25,520
and it was i was in a totally calm

1436
00:53:29,990 --> 00:53:27,839
state it was as peaceful as vision as it

1437
00:53:31,990 --> 00:53:30,000
could be it probably lasted click click

1438
00:53:33,829 --> 00:53:32,000
one second and i have like what amounts

1439
00:53:36,470 --> 00:53:33,839
to a single

1440
00:53:38,470 --> 00:53:36,480
slide like sort of seared into my memory

1441
00:53:40,790 --> 00:53:38,480
of that event

1442
00:53:42,150 --> 00:53:40,800
that is that is quite amazing that is

1443
00:53:45,990 --> 00:53:42,160
quite amazing

1444
00:53:49,270 --> 00:53:46,000
and i i have lots of experience with

1445
00:53:52,470 --> 00:53:49,280
the monroe institute and the hemisink

1446
00:53:54,950 --> 00:53:52,480
experience and it is it can be and it is

1447
00:53:56,470 --> 00:53:54,960
a powerful one in the right circumstance

1448
00:54:00,309 --> 00:53:56,480
absolutely

1449
00:54:02,549 --> 00:54:00,319
um my uh i have certain

1450
00:54:03,349 --> 00:54:02,559
uh things that i do to try to ground

1451
00:54:06,470 --> 00:54:03,359
myself

1452
00:54:07,349 --> 00:54:06,480
which is uh two things i can mention one

1453
00:54:11,109 --> 00:54:07,359
thing is

1454
00:54:14,230 --> 00:54:11,119
try to find uh the most uh pragmatic

1455
00:54:16,549 --> 00:54:14,240
and parsimonious explanation for stuff

1456
00:54:19,829 --> 00:54:16,559
that happens to me so i don't go

1457
00:54:21,829 --> 00:54:19,839
off you know off the deep end because i

1458
00:54:25,270 --> 00:54:21,839
come very close at times

1459
00:54:26,710 --> 00:54:25,280
as do i and so i try to look for the

1460
00:54:29,829 --> 00:54:26,720
most pragmatic thing

1461
00:54:31,750 --> 00:54:29,839
possible but often um

1462
00:54:33,510 --> 00:54:31,760
it isn't the most pragmatic thing

1463
00:54:36,309 --> 00:54:33,520
possible such as

1464
00:54:38,150 --> 00:54:36,319
the orange flash that we both

1465
00:54:39,270 --> 00:54:38,160
experienced at different times and

1466
00:54:42,470 --> 00:54:39,280
different days and

1467
00:54:43,190 --> 00:54:42,480
perhaps it wasn't an iridium flash in my

1468
00:54:46,230 --> 00:54:43,200
case

1469
00:54:49,190 --> 00:54:46,240
but i you know i try not to

1470
00:54:49,910 --> 00:54:49,200
focus and another stupid thing that i do

1471
00:54:52,390 --> 00:54:49,920
when i get

1472
00:54:53,990 --> 00:54:52,400
too overwhelmed with my thoughts about

1473
00:54:57,109 --> 00:54:54,000
these things even

1474
00:55:00,870 --> 00:54:57,119
in breaks and reading your books i went

1475
00:55:03,030 --> 00:55:00,880
and did um a i played solitaire a game

1476
00:55:05,589 --> 00:55:03,040
or two in between on the computer

1477
00:55:06,069 --> 00:55:05,599
to just sort of let my thoughts settle

1478
00:55:08,470 --> 00:55:06,079
because

1479
00:55:10,549 --> 00:55:08,480
when i play solitaire it's like a

1480
00:55:12,230 --> 00:55:10,559
meditation of sorts it just takes my

1481
00:55:13,349 --> 00:55:12,240
mind away from whatever's going on in

1482
00:55:15,589 --> 00:55:13,359
the present or

1483
00:55:17,750 --> 00:55:15,599
what i've been reading and it allows my

1484
00:55:19,910 --> 00:55:17,760
subconscious to sort of

1485
00:55:22,069 --> 00:55:19,920
uh you know shake my brain a little bit

1486
00:55:23,190 --> 00:55:22,079
and settle the thoughts so that i'm able

1487
00:55:25,109 --> 00:55:23,200
to go back to say

1488
00:55:27,589 --> 00:55:25,119
reading or to what i was thinking about

1489
00:55:30,309 --> 00:55:27,599
afterwards so it's it's my own little

1490
00:55:31,349 --> 00:55:30,319
meditation and bring my feet back onto

1491
00:55:34,390 --> 00:55:31,359
the ground

1492
00:55:37,589 --> 00:55:34,400
situation now one thing i

1493
00:55:40,870 --> 00:55:37,599
wanted to ask you about uh

1494
00:55:43,990 --> 00:55:40,880
i i've been to um

1495
00:55:46,390 --> 00:55:44,000
the omega institute a number of times

1496
00:55:47,430 --> 00:55:46,400
and one of the times i went there i've

1497
00:55:50,630 --> 00:55:47,440
been up there for

1498
00:55:52,630 --> 00:55:50,640
shamanic events and um

1499
00:55:54,230 --> 00:55:52,640
i was with a group a large group of

1500
00:55:58,230 --> 00:55:54,240
people for one of these

1501
00:55:59,589 --> 00:55:58,240
shamanic events with uh mr perkins i'm

1502
00:56:00,710 --> 00:55:59,599
trying to think of his first name not

1503
00:56:03,829 --> 00:56:00,720
david perkins

1504
00:56:05,990 --> 00:56:03,839
no um um um

1505
00:56:06,870 --> 00:56:06,000
oh john perkins john perkins the guy who

1506
00:56:09,510 --> 00:56:06,880
yeah the the

1507
00:56:10,309 --> 00:56:09,520
the hitman book what was it called the

1508
00:56:13,750 --> 00:56:10,319
economic hitman

1509
00:56:17,109 --> 00:56:13,760
up there

1510
00:56:21,349 --> 00:56:17,119
for one experience which involved the

1511
00:56:24,069 --> 00:56:21,359
meeting of the eagle and the condor

1512
00:56:25,670 --> 00:56:24,079
which was a shamanic gathering where

1513
00:56:28,950 --> 00:56:25,680
american people

1514
00:56:29,589 --> 00:56:28,960
who were involved on some level in a

1515
00:56:32,950 --> 00:56:29,599
shamanic

1516
00:56:36,069 --> 00:56:32,960
experiences would represent the eagle

1517
00:56:36,470 --> 00:56:36,079
and the the south american shamans that

1518
00:56:39,430 --> 00:56:36,480
he

1519
00:56:40,789 --> 00:56:39,440
had brought up from mostly peru but i

1520
00:56:42,470 --> 00:56:40,799
think there were a couple of countries

1521
00:56:44,870 --> 00:56:42,480
mostly peru

1522
00:56:46,710 --> 00:56:44,880
they represented the condor so we're

1523
00:56:47,510 --> 00:56:46,720
still talking about birds here on some

1524
00:56:50,630 --> 00:56:47,520
level

1525
00:56:54,870 --> 00:56:50,640
uh and there were a number of people

1526
00:56:58,950 --> 00:56:54,880
who were fully or part native american

1527
00:57:01,510 --> 00:56:58,960
and they uh indicated to me

1528
00:57:02,470 --> 00:57:01,520
that there is a big prohibition or a

1529
00:57:06,150 --> 00:57:02,480
taboo

1530
00:57:09,190 --> 00:57:06,160
on owl magic among a lot of uh

1531
00:57:10,630 --> 00:57:09,200
native american first nations tribes so

1532
00:57:11,270 --> 00:57:10,640
do you want to speak to that a minute or

1533
00:57:12,950 --> 00:57:11,280
two

1534
00:57:14,710 --> 00:57:12,960
so i'm not i'm not an expert on this by

1535
00:57:16,069 --> 00:57:14,720
any means in my s and from what i my

1536
00:57:18,630 --> 00:57:16,079
understanding is it depends on

1537
00:57:19,910 --> 00:57:18,640
the tribe right so the if clustered

1538
00:57:23,109 --> 00:57:19,920
around let's say the um

1539
00:57:25,910 --> 00:57:23,119
the southwest plains indians boy the

1540
00:57:26,549 --> 00:57:25,920
zuni and the hopi and the navajo owl is

1541
00:57:30,870 --> 00:57:26,559
like

1542
00:57:34,549 --> 00:57:30,880
bad medicine yes and and i spoke to um

1543
00:57:37,430 --> 00:57:34,559
i think he was navajo and he said

1544
00:57:38,390 --> 00:57:37,440
that the um it's funny he did not know

1545
00:57:39,589 --> 00:57:38,400
about my book

1546
00:57:41,430 --> 00:57:39,599
and he's because i was speaking at a

1547
00:57:42,789 --> 00:57:41,440
conference and he was selling some

1548
00:57:43,910 --> 00:57:42,799
jewelry him and his wife were selling

1549
00:57:44,870 --> 00:57:43,920
some jewelry at a table at this

1550
00:57:47,910 --> 00:57:44,880
conference and

1551
00:57:49,270 --> 00:57:47,920
and he he said you're the owl guy and i

1552
00:57:49,589 --> 00:57:49,280
said yeah yeah because he saw the little

1553
00:57:51,510 --> 00:57:49,599
and

1554
00:57:52,870 --> 00:57:51,520
he didn't know that he said our we call

1555
00:57:54,069 --> 00:57:52,880
the owl the messenger

1556
00:57:55,829 --> 00:57:54,079
and i was like well that's the name of

1557
00:57:57,030 --> 00:57:55,839
the book he said and he said in their

1558
00:57:59,829 --> 00:57:57,040
language

1559
00:58:01,910 --> 00:57:59,839
owl and sinister are synonyms they're

1560
00:58:04,630 --> 00:58:01,920
the same word

1561
00:58:05,190 --> 00:58:04,640
so yeah you don't it's like i talked to

1562
00:58:07,589 --> 00:58:05,200
someone who

1563
00:58:08,309 --> 00:58:07,599
um uh worked at a little elementary

1564
00:58:11,910 --> 00:58:08,319
school

1565
00:58:13,109 --> 00:58:11,920
in in uh uh

1566
00:58:15,030 --> 00:58:13,119
i can't remember where it was i think it

1567
00:58:16,710 --> 00:58:15,040
was in arizona and

1568
00:58:18,630 --> 00:58:16,720
and so she was a poor community and she

1569
00:58:19,670 --> 00:58:18,640
was volunteering there and

1570
00:58:21,990 --> 00:58:19,680
came time the kids were going to

1571
00:58:23,109 --> 00:58:22,000
graduate the school year was over so she

1572
00:58:24,710 --> 00:58:23,119
put all these little like

1573
00:58:26,390 --> 00:58:24,720
you know the things you would get at any

1574
00:58:28,630 --> 00:58:26,400
little at the drugstore you know there's

1575
00:58:30,069 --> 00:58:28,640
little pictures of owls with little

1576
00:58:31,510 --> 00:58:30,079
graduation camps and she

1577
00:58:32,710 --> 00:58:31,520
caps on their head and so she

1578
00:58:33,190 --> 00:58:32,720
thumbtacked those up to the bulletin

1579
00:58:36,710 --> 00:58:33,200
board and

1580
00:58:37,030 --> 00:58:36,720
boy the parents came came in and like uh

1581
00:58:38,630 --> 00:58:37,040
uh

1582
00:58:40,870 --> 00:58:38,640
don't do that you can't do that it was

1583
00:58:42,950 --> 00:58:40,880
like that was that was

1584
00:58:45,430 --> 00:58:42,960
and this was a native american community

1585
00:58:48,230 --> 00:58:45,440
is a native american community in in uh

1586
00:58:50,470 --> 00:58:48,240
and i think arizona uh-huh so that so

1587
00:58:52,470 --> 00:58:50,480
yes so there's a very strong

1588
00:58:53,829 --> 00:58:52,480
now owls are associated with death in

1589
00:58:56,069 --> 00:58:53,839
almost every culture

1590
00:58:57,109 --> 00:58:56,079
and that's and that's understandable

1591
00:58:58,789 --> 00:58:57,119
even in our culture

1592
00:59:00,150 --> 00:58:58,799
even in the simplest form like if

1593
00:59:02,549 --> 00:59:00,160
someone's if uh

1594
00:59:03,910 --> 00:59:02,559
if um you want to create a scary mood

1595
00:59:04,950 --> 00:59:03,920
right you just and you're making a movie

1596
00:59:06,150 --> 00:59:04,960
you just have someone walk through the

1597
00:59:07,030 --> 00:59:06,160
woods at night and have to hear an owl

1598
00:59:09,430 --> 00:59:07,040
hooting and boom

1599
00:59:11,349 --> 00:59:09,440
everyone that establishes this is eerie

1600
00:59:11,990 --> 00:59:11,359
this is spooky everyone recognizes that

1601
00:59:14,549 --> 00:59:12,000
little

1602
00:59:16,549 --> 00:59:14,559
sound effect um but i don't think that's

1603
00:59:18,309 --> 00:59:16,559
necessarily true of all the tribes

1604
00:59:19,910 --> 00:59:18,319
and i can't speak i know that some where

1605
00:59:20,549 --> 00:59:19,920
i'm in the northeast here the mikmaq

1606
00:59:22,470 --> 00:59:20,559
tribe

1607
00:59:23,829 --> 00:59:22,480
um it's my understanding they have they

1608
00:59:25,829 --> 00:59:23,839
treat the owl

1609
00:59:27,190 --> 00:59:25,839
with a different kind of reverence um it

1610
00:59:29,430 --> 00:59:27,200
is often

1611
00:59:31,030 --> 00:59:29,440
still considered to be a messenger of a

1612
00:59:31,670 --> 00:59:31,040
bad omen that doesn't make the owl bad

1613
00:59:34,710 --> 00:59:31,680
but it can

1614
00:59:37,190 --> 00:59:34,720
it can be delivering a bad message

1615
00:59:38,870 --> 00:59:37,200
i have not found this in my research

1616
00:59:39,750 --> 00:59:38,880
except for some fleeting cases i have

1617
00:59:42,390 --> 00:59:39,760
not found this

1618
00:59:43,270 --> 00:59:42,400
i have found i have found certainly the

1619
00:59:45,910 --> 00:59:43,280
owl shows up

1620
00:59:46,950 --> 00:59:45,920
before very challenging experiences

1621
00:59:49,030 --> 00:59:46,960
doesn't make them bad

1622
00:59:50,710 --> 00:59:49,040
right before challenging experiences and

1623
00:59:53,030 --> 00:59:50,720
i've also found

1624
00:59:53,990 --> 00:59:53,040
very few stories of owls showing up

1625
00:59:55,829 --> 00:59:54,000
before a death

1626
00:59:57,990 --> 00:59:55,839
that's the folklore i was showing it

1627
00:59:59,990 --> 00:59:58,000
before a death

1628
01:00:01,109 --> 01:00:00,000
i have found almost none of those i

1629
01:00:04,549 --> 01:00:01,119
found many

1630
01:00:09,910 --> 01:00:04,559
many examples of owls showing up after

1631
01:00:13,030 --> 01:00:12,230
uh often the death of a parent

1632
01:00:16,069 --> 01:00:13,040
interesting

1633
01:00:17,910 --> 01:00:16,079
bring this up and

1634
01:00:20,150 --> 01:00:17,920
um i'm not going to tell this whole

1635
01:00:23,670 --> 01:00:20,160
story here right now

1636
01:00:28,630 --> 01:00:23,680
but um when i went

1637
01:00:32,150 --> 01:00:28,640
uh to disperse the ashes

1638
01:00:35,750 --> 01:00:32,160
of my parents um

1639
01:00:36,630 --> 01:00:35,760
i went to certain places to sprinkle a

1640
01:00:40,710 --> 01:00:36,640
few ashes

1641
01:00:47,030 --> 01:00:45,030
paris uh dif pairs of ducks showed up

1642
01:00:48,710 --> 01:00:47,040
in places where you would not expect

1643
01:00:51,109 --> 01:00:48,720
pairs of ducks to show up

1644
01:00:53,349 --> 01:00:51,119
or one place that a pair of ducks could

1645
01:00:54,150 --> 01:00:53,359
show up but just as soon as i put some

1646
01:00:57,430 --> 01:00:54,160
ashes

1647
01:00:59,670 --> 01:00:57,440
by the edge of the water ducks showed up

1648
01:01:03,109 --> 01:00:59,680
in three different places

1649
01:01:06,549 --> 01:01:03,119
so um perhaps i will email you

1650
01:01:07,670 --> 01:01:06,559
my uh my little story from my blog about

1651
01:01:11,510 --> 01:01:07,680
that

1652
01:01:12,789 --> 01:01:11,520
birds in general i think birds are birds

1653
01:01:14,950 --> 01:01:12,799
are associated with death but

1654
01:01:16,630 --> 01:01:14,960
in owls i'm getting the owl stories

1655
01:01:18,309 --> 01:01:16,640
right so i've got i'm just thinking open

1656
01:01:19,829 --> 01:01:18,319
call so it's not it's not by accident

1657
01:01:21,349 --> 01:01:19,839
that i'm getting owl stories i'm asking

1658
01:01:23,190 --> 01:01:21,359
for them and they're arriving so

1659
01:01:25,109 --> 01:01:23,200
um and but there's certainly here's the

1660
01:01:28,150 --> 01:01:25,119
story um a woman

1661
01:01:29,510 --> 01:01:28,160
i had a hawk show up at her house

1662
01:01:31,670 --> 01:01:29,520
it was showing up all the time it was

1663
01:01:33,190 --> 01:01:31,680
like making itself known and she was a

1664
01:01:34,470 --> 01:01:33,200
private detective this was great if you

1665
01:01:37,990 --> 01:01:34,480
want to like she was a good

1666
01:01:39,750 --> 01:01:38,000
person to interact with so she she uh

1667
01:01:41,030 --> 01:01:39,760
uh i mean she was very level-headed and

1668
01:01:42,390 --> 01:01:41,040
grounded and and

1669
01:01:44,069 --> 01:01:42,400
she's like why is this hawk showing up

1670
01:01:45,349 --> 01:01:44,079
in my house and like i don't know like

1671
01:01:46,710 --> 01:01:45,359
how am i supposed to know like the next

1672
01:01:48,150 --> 01:01:46,720
time it shows up i just made this up on

1673
01:01:49,829 --> 01:01:48,160
the spot next time it shows up you ask

1674
01:01:51,349 --> 01:01:49,839
the hawk just ask it aloud

1675
01:01:52,870 --> 01:01:51,359
and so the hawk showed up again and she

1676
01:01:54,309 --> 01:01:52,880
was it was on her garage roof and she

1677
01:01:55,349 --> 01:01:54,319
looked at this hawk and she said i very

1678
01:01:57,589 --> 01:01:55,359
respectfully

1679
01:01:59,029 --> 01:01:57,599
ask why you are here i am grateful for

1680
01:02:00,390 --> 01:01:59,039
your visit but i'm asking you why are

1681
01:02:01,510 --> 01:02:00,400
you visiting me

1682
01:02:02,309 --> 01:02:01,520
and the hawk looked at her and she

1683
01:02:03,589 --> 01:02:02,319
looked at the hawk and the hawk

1684
01:02:04,950 --> 01:02:03,599
eventually flew away and she walked in

1685
01:02:07,109 --> 01:02:04,960
the house and the phone rang

1686
01:02:08,470 --> 01:02:07,119
she picked up the phone and there was

1687
01:02:12,230 --> 01:02:08,480
nobody there

1688
01:02:14,870 --> 01:02:12,240
and the the call the the the name on the

1689
01:02:15,910 --> 01:02:14,880
it gave the town on the where the call

1690
01:02:19,029 --> 01:02:15,920
came from

1691
01:02:21,829 --> 01:02:19,039
it was from francine

1692
01:02:23,270 --> 01:02:21,839
uh massachusetts and she's a private

1693
01:02:24,789 --> 01:02:23,280
detective she's like looked up francine

1694
01:02:25,990 --> 01:02:24,799
there is no francine massachusetts she

1695
01:02:26,870 --> 01:02:26,000
dug and she dug and she dug she called

1696
01:02:28,230 --> 01:02:26,880
the phone company

1697
01:02:31,829 --> 01:02:28,240
she actually found out that there was a

1698
01:02:32,470 --> 01:02:31,839
francine like exchange that had long

1699
01:02:35,190 --> 01:02:32,480
since been

1700
01:02:36,630 --> 01:02:35,200
you know back when wires and land lines

1701
01:02:38,150 --> 01:02:36,640
and stuff they would have exchanges and

1702
01:02:39,270 --> 01:02:38,160
it just it didn't it was like that was

1703
01:02:41,990 --> 01:02:39,280
the location it came from it didn't

1704
01:02:43,589 --> 01:02:42,000
there's no town called francine

1705
01:02:46,630 --> 01:02:43,599
her mother's name was francine and her

1706
01:02:49,670 --> 01:02:46,640
mother had just recently died

1707
01:02:51,670 --> 01:02:49,680
so how like who organized that

1708
01:02:52,950 --> 01:02:51,680
right i mean that was to me that i i

1709
01:02:55,190 --> 01:02:52,960
don't know that i call that magic right

1710
01:02:57,510 --> 01:02:55,200
some magical event took place

1711
01:02:58,230 --> 01:02:57,520
so certainly so she asked the owl she

1712
01:02:59,589 --> 01:02:58,240
asked the hawk

1713
01:03:01,750 --> 01:02:59,599
i almost called it a novel she asked the

1714
01:03:02,069 --> 01:03:01,760
hawk can you tell me why you're here and

1715
01:03:06,470 --> 01:03:02,079
then

1716
01:03:09,829 --> 01:03:06,480
boom a bell rings from francine

1717
01:03:12,150 --> 01:03:09,839
that is quite amazing and to add to all

1718
01:03:14,789 --> 01:03:12,160
these synchronicities mike

1719
01:03:15,510 --> 01:03:14,799
today is the anniversary of my mother's

1720
01:03:19,349 --> 01:03:15,520
birthday

1721
01:03:21,190 --> 01:03:19,359
who was has passed and uh we're talking

1722
01:03:24,710 --> 01:03:21,200
about all of this

1723
01:03:27,109 --> 01:03:24,720
and i happen to look on my facebook

1724
01:03:27,990 --> 01:03:27,119
page and they try to tell you do you

1725
01:03:30,230 --> 01:03:28,000
want to

1726
01:03:31,270 --> 01:03:30,240
repeat something that you said like a

1727
01:03:33,990 --> 01:03:31,280
few years ago

1728
01:03:35,029 --> 01:03:34,000
on this day you know do you want to put

1729
01:03:37,910 --> 01:03:35,039
this out again

1730
01:03:39,510 --> 01:03:37,920
and i had kind of forgotten this but it

1731
01:03:42,950 --> 01:03:39,520
did apparently happen

1732
01:03:46,470 --> 01:03:42,960
that in 2011 um

1733
01:03:47,190 --> 01:03:46,480
the doorbell rang on this day and no one

1734
01:03:49,349 --> 01:03:47,200
was there

1735
01:03:51,589 --> 01:03:49,359
and i really felt like it was a message

1736
01:03:53,349 --> 01:03:51,599
from my mother

1737
01:03:55,430 --> 01:03:53,359
how interesting yeah today is also what

1738
01:03:56,069 --> 01:03:55,440
i consider my confirmation event where i

1739
01:03:58,309 --> 01:03:56,079
had where i

1740
01:03:59,510 --> 01:03:58,319
basically like had the event which is

1741
01:04:00,870 --> 01:03:59,520
long takes about a half hour to tell

1742
01:04:04,069 --> 01:04:00,880
this story i won't go into it now

1743
01:04:08,309 --> 01:04:04,079
but i had a psychic vision on march 12th

1744
01:04:11,270 --> 01:04:08,319
2013 two days after that that event

1745
01:04:13,270 --> 01:04:11,280
um uh where i saw the roundhouse on the

1746
01:04:15,829 --> 01:04:13,280
hill so the question i ask people

1747
01:04:17,190 --> 01:04:15,839
what happened after your ufo event what

1748
01:04:17,829 --> 01:04:17,200
changed in your life so what changed in

1749
01:04:19,670 --> 01:04:17,839
my life

1750
01:04:21,910 --> 01:04:19,680
less than 48 hours after that event was

1751
01:04:24,950 --> 01:04:21,920
basically i had an absolute

1752
01:04:26,549 --> 01:04:24,960
total knowing that this stuff was really

1753
01:04:28,309 --> 01:04:26,559
happening i had been denying it and

1754
01:04:30,069 --> 01:04:28,319
trying to weasel my way out of it

1755
01:04:31,349 --> 01:04:30,079
but i had an absolute total knowing that

1756
01:04:33,349 --> 01:04:31,359
this was real

1757
01:04:34,870 --> 01:04:33,359
and um and i've never and that's i've

1758
01:04:38,390 --> 01:04:34,880
been at that place since

1759
01:04:41,990 --> 01:04:38,400
so are you a philosophical idealist

1760
01:04:48,630 --> 01:04:45,190
do you have a inner

1761
01:04:51,829 --> 01:04:48,640
feeling that what we experience

1762
01:04:55,510 --> 01:04:51,839
in 4d what we call reality

1763
01:04:55,990 --> 01:04:55,520
is almost in itself a screen memory and

1764
01:05:00,710 --> 01:04:56,000
that

1765
01:05:03,029 --> 01:05:00,720
our real essence is something else

1766
01:05:04,390 --> 01:05:03,039
so the answer to that one is yes okay

1767
01:05:05,750 --> 01:05:04,400
yes very much so so

1768
01:05:07,990 --> 01:05:05,760
i mean that was a very nice way to put

1769
01:05:09,029 --> 01:05:08,000
it and yeah i mean whatever this is that

1770
01:05:14,390 --> 01:05:09,039
we're we're

1771
01:05:16,150 --> 01:05:14,400
don't know how else you know we're

1772
01:05:17,670 --> 01:05:16,160
like the construct right what does it

1773
01:05:19,349 --> 01:05:17,680
mean and you see they talk to

1774
01:05:20,950 --> 01:05:19,359
physicists in it like there's like

1775
01:05:22,470 --> 01:05:20,960
there's no matter

1776
01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:22,480
right we should be able to just pass our

1777
01:05:25,349 --> 01:05:24,000
hand through the table but we can't

1778
01:05:28,630 --> 01:05:25,359
there's something there's some

1779
01:05:30,309 --> 01:05:28,640
there's some like you know like the code

1780
01:05:31,829 --> 01:05:30,319
that was typed into the hard drive

1781
01:05:34,230 --> 01:05:31,839
says no you're gonna you're gonna bump

1782
01:05:36,150 --> 01:05:34,240
your stub your toe if you kick the table

1783
01:05:38,390 --> 01:05:36,160
but in the reality there's there's

1784
01:05:39,190 --> 01:05:38,400
no matter at all the atoms when you get

1785
01:05:42,230 --> 01:05:39,200
right down to the

1786
01:05:42,870 --> 01:05:42,240
are just little fluffs of energy so i i

1787
01:05:45,029 --> 01:05:42,880
agree

1788
01:05:46,150 --> 01:05:45,039
there's no there there there's no there

1789
01:05:48,549 --> 01:05:46,160
there exactly

1790
01:05:49,430 --> 01:05:48,559
so except the same time i you you stub

1791
01:05:53,029 --> 01:05:49,440
your toe and it hurts

1792
01:05:56,309 --> 01:05:53,039
yeah so one other thing that really um

1793
01:05:57,990 --> 01:05:56,319
surprised me all of a sudden when i came

1794
01:06:00,230 --> 01:05:58,000
upon the chapter

1795
01:06:02,150 --> 01:06:00,240
about dr kirby's surprise what ever

1796
01:06:03,990 --> 01:06:02,160
happened to that gentleman

1797
01:06:05,190 --> 01:06:04,000
he's around oh he's around yeah he's

1798
01:06:06,870 --> 01:06:05,200
he's i could

1799
01:06:08,470 --> 01:06:06,880
call him up he said he lives in san

1800
01:06:11,510 --> 01:06:08,480
francisco he's a practicing

1801
01:06:11,990 --> 01:06:11,520
uh clinician and um uh there's i want

1802
01:06:15,029 --> 01:06:12,000
this

1803
01:06:15,589 --> 01:06:15,039
yes he's a very smart interesting guy he

1804
01:06:17,750 --> 01:06:15,599
would be a

1805
01:06:18,789 --> 01:06:17,760
great guest on your show i would love to

1806
01:06:20,630 --> 01:06:18,799
have him on the show

1807
01:06:22,470 --> 01:06:20,640
his book is wonderful his book is called

1808
01:06:23,750 --> 01:06:22,480
synchronicity his name is dr kirby

1809
01:06:26,150 --> 01:06:23,760
surprise

1810
01:06:27,430 --> 01:06:26,160
he so here's what so this is a funny

1811
01:06:31,270 --> 01:06:27,440
story so like

1812
01:06:32,710 --> 01:06:31,280
i was listening to him

1813
01:06:34,230 --> 01:06:32,720
he was being his book came out he was

1814
01:06:35,510 --> 01:06:34,240
doing a little podcast circuit and i was

1815
01:06:37,109 --> 01:06:35,520
listening to a lot of podcasts at the

1816
01:06:39,029 --> 01:06:37,119
time it's going back about i guess must

1817
01:06:41,030 --> 01:06:39,039
2012 or so

1818
01:06:42,549 --> 01:06:41,040
um and uh

1819
01:06:44,150 --> 01:06:42,559
[Music]

1820
01:06:45,109 --> 01:06:44,160
and i basically contacted him and said

1821
01:06:46,870 --> 01:06:45,119
listen i'm having a lot of

1822
01:06:48,789 --> 01:06:46,880
synchronicities

1823
01:06:50,470 --> 01:06:48,799
and i've also feel i've had ufo contact

1824
01:06:51,190 --> 01:06:50,480
and i feel that synchronicities and ufo

1825
01:06:53,589 --> 01:06:51,200
contact

1826
01:06:55,510 --> 01:06:53,599
are connected and then heat gets back to

1827
01:06:57,029 --> 01:06:55,520
me and i'm paraphrasing from memory but

1828
01:06:59,190 --> 01:06:57,039
um and he gave me permission to say all

1829
01:07:00,870 --> 01:06:59,200
this he says

1830
01:07:02,789 --> 01:07:00,880
well you know that's all well and good

1831
01:07:05,029 --> 01:07:02,799
but i've had my own ufo contact and it

1832
01:07:07,029 --> 01:07:05,039
does it's not related to synchronicity

1833
01:07:08,789 --> 01:07:07,039
and i'm like like this is in an email

1834
01:07:09,510 --> 01:07:08,799
and i'm like i'm like wait a minute you

1835
01:07:11,270 --> 01:07:09,520
like

1836
01:07:12,630 --> 01:07:11,280
you you wrote a book about synchronicity

1837
01:07:13,510 --> 01:07:12,640
and you had ufo contact and you don't

1838
01:07:15,910 --> 01:07:13,520
think it's

1839
01:07:17,750 --> 01:07:15,920
connected and he was like i see where

1840
01:07:19,029 --> 01:07:17,760
you're going with this read my book

1841
01:07:21,029 --> 01:07:19,039
i think you'll enjoy it just and then

1842
01:07:23,349 --> 01:07:21,039
let's talk and so i read his book and on

1843
01:07:25,270 --> 01:07:23,359
page like 219 or something like that

1844
01:07:26,470 --> 01:07:25,280
he says you can generate synchronicities

1845
01:07:27,430 --> 01:07:26,480
which i think you can do he says you

1846
01:07:32,230 --> 01:07:27,440
simply ask

1847
01:07:34,230 --> 01:07:32,240
would you generate synchronicities for

1848
01:07:36,230 --> 01:07:34,240
me on a theme and he says

1849
01:07:37,670 --> 01:07:36,240
here's what i like to do i like to

1850
01:07:41,349 --> 01:07:37,680
create owls

1851
01:07:43,190 --> 01:07:41,359
so like here's the guy with ufo contact

1852
01:07:45,349 --> 01:07:43,200
we talked about it it's it's it's a very

1853
01:07:48,230 --> 01:07:45,359
interesting set of stories he has

1854
01:07:49,670 --> 01:07:48,240
here's a guy with ufo contact writes a

1855
01:07:52,390 --> 01:07:49,680
book about synchronicities

1856
01:07:53,910 --> 01:07:52,400
and creates a holes like this is owl

1857
01:07:55,270 --> 01:07:53,920
synchronous cities and ufos this is the

1858
01:07:57,430 --> 01:07:55,280
core of my research so

1859
01:07:59,750 --> 01:07:57,440
we had a wonderful talk and he was and

1860
01:08:00,390 --> 01:07:59,760
i'm so glad i recorded it i love that

1861
01:08:03,430 --> 01:08:00,400
chapter

1862
01:08:05,990 --> 01:08:03,440
and he came i felt like um you know

1863
01:08:07,990 --> 01:08:06,000
luke skywalker at you know sitting with

1864
01:08:08,870 --> 01:08:08,000
yoda would like talking with him he had

1865
01:08:12,150 --> 01:08:08,880
he was

1866
01:08:15,190 --> 01:08:12,160
and it was a

1867
01:08:18,309 --> 01:08:15,200
joy to talk to him wow

1868
01:08:20,950 --> 01:08:18,319
yeah i i'm very interested in him um

1869
01:08:22,309 --> 01:08:20,960
and i'm very interested in finding out

1870
01:08:25,430 --> 01:08:22,319
more about him so

1871
01:08:27,510 --> 01:08:25,440
perhaps i will try to contact him again

1872
01:08:29,749 --> 01:08:27,520
i think i tried to contact him a couple

1873
01:08:33,430 --> 01:08:29,759
of years ago and was unsuccessful

1874
01:08:34,550 --> 01:08:33,440
but perhaps now would be a good time to

1875
01:08:37,590 --> 01:08:34,560
do so

1876
01:08:39,349 --> 01:08:37,600
um getting back you want to tell us the

1877
01:08:42,470 --> 01:08:39,359
name of your books again

1878
01:08:45,189 --> 01:08:42,480
and anything just for your own sake

1879
01:08:46,550 --> 01:08:45,199
yeah yeah so the books are um the first

1880
01:08:48,229 --> 01:08:46,560
book is the messengers

1881
01:08:49,749 --> 01:08:48,239
it's a little bigger than the second

1882
01:08:51,829 --> 01:08:49,759
book and um

1883
01:08:53,349 --> 01:08:51,839
the subtitle is owls synchronicity in

1884
01:08:55,430 --> 01:08:53,359
the ufo abductee

1885
01:08:56,630 --> 01:08:55,440
and the second book is stories from the

1886
01:08:58,630 --> 01:08:56,640
messengers

1887
01:09:00,470 --> 01:08:58,640
and the subtitle is accounts of owls

1888
01:09:02,550 --> 01:09:00,480
ufos in a deeper reality

1889
01:09:03,510 --> 01:09:02,560
and um they have actually been quite

1890
01:09:06,070 --> 01:09:03,520
successful

1891
01:09:06,630 --> 01:09:06,080
my publisher is extremely happy there i

1892
01:09:09,349 --> 01:09:06,640
mean

1893
01:09:10,070 --> 01:09:09,359
nobody's ufo books really sell that many

1894
01:09:11,669 --> 01:09:10,080
but um

1895
01:09:13,829 --> 01:09:11,679
they're selling quite well and they've

1896
01:09:16,950 --> 01:09:13,839
been extremely well received i

1897
01:09:19,110 --> 01:09:16,960
it's uh i mean i go way

1898
01:09:19,990 --> 01:09:19,120
out there with my speculation like i'm i

1899
01:09:21,990 --> 01:09:20,000
just try to leave no

1900
01:09:23,669 --> 01:09:22,000
stone unturned and just wrestle with all

1901
01:09:25,910 --> 01:09:23,679
these ideas the best i can

1902
01:09:27,510 --> 01:09:25,920
and um yeah so i'm ex and i've said this

1903
01:09:29,510 --> 01:09:27,520
before i am

1904
01:09:30,789 --> 01:09:29,520
i'm extremely proud of these books i've

1905
01:09:32,229 --> 01:09:30,799
worked really hard on them

1906
01:09:34,229 --> 01:09:32,239
and i'm happy with the way they turned

1907
01:09:35,829 --> 01:09:34,239
out and i'm very proud of them so

1908
01:09:37,950 --> 01:09:35,839
those can you can find those very easily

1909
01:09:39,990 --> 01:09:37,960
my name is mike clelland

1910
01:09:40,870 --> 01:09:40,000
c-l-e-l-l-a-n-d you can find me easy

1911
01:09:43,669 --> 01:09:40,880
enough on

1912
01:09:45,030 --> 01:09:43,679
googling and you can get those books on

1913
01:09:46,149 --> 01:09:45,040
amazon that's probably the easiest way

1914
01:09:47,590 --> 01:09:46,159
to do it or you can go to your local

1915
01:09:48,470 --> 01:09:47,600
bookstore and just ask them and they can

1916
01:09:51,829 --> 01:09:48,480
order them

1917
01:09:52,229 --> 01:09:51,839
well before we go i just i want you to

1918
01:09:54,950 --> 01:09:52,239
tell

1919
01:09:56,149 --> 01:09:54,960
another story but before you do that i

1920
01:09:59,430 --> 01:09:56,159
want to say

1921
01:10:00,070 --> 01:09:59,440
that i had heard you on other podcasts

1922
01:10:02,310 --> 01:10:00,080
before

1923
01:10:03,830 --> 01:10:02,320
and i have a very very bad habit it's

1924
01:10:05,750 --> 01:10:03,840
not a bad habit it's you know something

1925
01:10:06,310 --> 01:10:05,760
that i do i guess it's not evil bad but

1926
01:10:10,790 --> 01:10:06,320
it's

1927
01:10:11,590 --> 01:10:10,800
listen to a podcast as i'm falling

1928
01:10:14,310 --> 01:10:11,600
asleep

1929
01:10:18,070 --> 01:10:14,320
and sometimes i don't get to hear the

1930
01:10:20,950 --> 01:10:18,080
end of the podcast because i fell asleep

1931
01:10:21,830 --> 01:10:20,960
and um i have heard you on other

1932
01:10:24,390 --> 01:10:21,840
people's

1933
01:10:26,310 --> 01:10:24,400
shows and it's i've always heard the

1934
01:10:28,070 --> 01:10:26,320
story about you going camping at

1935
01:10:30,630 --> 01:10:28,080
the beginning of the show which is why i

1936
01:10:31,350 --> 01:10:30,640
didn't let you do it many times i was so

1937
01:10:34,390 --> 01:10:31,360
glad you

1938
01:10:35,990 --> 01:10:34,400
didn't let me tell that one today but i

1939
01:10:38,550 --> 01:10:36,000
always thought that you were interesting

1940
01:10:42,669 --> 01:10:38,560
i thought that you had sort of a

1941
01:10:44,870 --> 01:10:42,679
niche place in the in the group of uh

1942
01:10:46,470 --> 01:10:44,880
experiencers and researchers and so

1943
01:10:47,910 --> 01:10:46,480
forth and it was a niche thing

1944
01:10:49,510 --> 01:10:47,920
but it was kind of cool and it was kind

1945
01:10:51,910 --> 01:10:49,520
of interesting and

1946
01:10:53,669 --> 01:10:51,920
i let it go with that but when i was

1947
01:10:55,750 --> 01:10:53,679
reading your book

1948
01:10:57,430 --> 01:10:55,760
um it was especially when i first

1949
01:10:59,270 --> 01:10:57,440
started as you recall i i

1950
01:11:00,870 --> 01:10:59,280
contacted you when i first started about

1951
01:11:03,990 --> 01:11:00,880
something that happened

1952
01:11:07,189 --> 01:11:04,000
to me i was just getting in maybe

1953
01:11:07,669 --> 01:11:07,199
10 15 20 pages into the book and i was

1954
01:11:10,709 --> 01:11:07,679
saying

1955
01:11:12,950 --> 01:11:10,719
wow this is much more

1956
01:11:15,350 --> 01:11:12,960
than i thought it's much more than a

1957
01:11:18,709 --> 01:11:15,360
niche experience he really has

1958
01:11:19,669 --> 01:11:18,719
something going on here um and at that

1959
01:11:23,990 --> 01:11:19,679
point

1960
01:11:26,950 --> 01:11:24,000
i had to hang up my laundry

1961
01:11:28,070 --> 01:11:26,960
and i hung up my laundry uh in a

1962
01:11:31,110 --> 01:11:28,080
bathroom

1963
01:11:34,950 --> 01:11:31,120
over a tub and it was very light laundry

1964
01:11:37,990 --> 01:11:34,960
uh it was mostly um a lady's

1965
01:11:41,189 --> 01:11:38,000
unmentionables and um

1966
01:11:43,189 --> 01:11:41,199
put it up on a hanger with the kind of

1967
01:11:43,669 --> 01:11:43,199
clothespin hanger that's all made into

1968
01:11:47,110 --> 01:11:43,679
the

1969
01:11:50,550 --> 01:11:47,120
branches on it and you hang up your

1970
01:11:52,229 --> 01:11:50,560
your underwear basically and uh so i did

1971
01:11:53,590 --> 01:11:52,239
that and i'm thinking about the book and

1972
01:11:55,030 --> 01:11:53,600
i'm thinking wow this is really kind of

1973
01:11:56,470 --> 01:11:55,040
cool you know this is more than i

1974
01:11:59,189 --> 01:11:56,480
thought it was

1975
01:12:00,950 --> 01:11:59,199
and i tried i turned off the light i

1976
01:12:04,310 --> 01:12:00,960
left the bathroom

1977
01:12:08,070 --> 01:12:04,320
and like a fraction of a second

1978
01:12:08,790 --> 01:12:08,080
after i turned out the light i heard a

1979
01:12:11,669 --> 01:12:08,800
crash

1980
01:12:12,470 --> 01:12:11,679
and i thought damn the thing fell into

1981
01:12:23,189 --> 01:12:12,480
the

1982
01:12:24,470 --> 01:12:23,199
i have to go and figure this out and i

1983
01:12:27,830 --> 01:12:24,480
hope it's not broken

1984
01:12:29,590 --> 01:12:27,840
i went back in the stuff was hanging

1985
01:12:32,790 --> 01:12:29,600
still over the top of this

1986
01:12:36,310 --> 01:12:32,800
the uh shower curtain rack

1987
01:12:38,070 --> 01:12:36,320
but there in the in the tub were two

1988
01:12:39,830 --> 01:12:38,080
quarters

1989
01:12:41,830 --> 01:12:39,840
came out of nowhere came out of the

1990
01:12:44,470 --> 01:12:41,840
ceiling there was nothing there

1991
01:12:46,870 --> 01:12:44,480
to put the two quarters to have any

1992
01:12:49,030 --> 01:12:46,880
reason for the two quarters to be there

1993
01:12:51,910 --> 01:12:49,040
and we had a little discussion about it

1994
01:12:54,870 --> 01:12:51,920
you and i online and i really decided

1995
01:12:55,910 --> 01:12:54,880
it was happened to make me pay attention

1996
01:12:58,790 --> 01:12:55,920
to you

1997
01:13:00,070 --> 01:12:58,800
to really take what you had to say very

1998
01:13:03,030 --> 01:13:00,080
seriously

1999
01:13:04,709 --> 01:13:03,040
and not that i don't take my my my uh

2000
01:13:07,270 --> 01:13:04,719
guest seriously i do i

2001
01:13:08,790 --> 01:13:07,280
take everyone seriously that i

2002
01:13:11,270 --> 01:13:08,800
determined to have on the show

2003
01:13:13,270 --> 01:13:11,280
or in the case of kate and i that we

2004
01:13:16,550 --> 01:13:13,280
determined to have on the show but

2005
01:13:19,750 --> 01:13:16,560
lately it's been me and um so

2006
01:13:22,070 --> 01:13:19,760
i i really put a lot more thought

2007
01:13:22,790 --> 01:13:22,080
into this in the sense that when we

2008
01:13:24,630 --> 01:13:22,800
started

2009
01:13:26,310 --> 01:13:24,640
i said this is going to be a little bit

2010
01:13:27,189 --> 01:13:26,320
different kind of interview because i'm

2011
01:13:30,790 --> 01:13:27,199
going to

2012
01:13:32,070 --> 01:13:30,800
participate somewhat equally if you will

2013
01:13:34,229 --> 01:13:32,080
and i that's the kind of interview i

2014
01:13:35,430 --> 01:13:34,239
prefer so that's a wonderful story and i

2015
01:13:38,229 --> 01:13:35,440
don't know how to say this

2016
01:13:38,790 --> 01:13:38,239
what you just shared i have heard that

2017
01:13:41,910 --> 01:13:38,800
in

2018
01:13:42,550 --> 01:13:41,920
so many variations essentially what you

2019
01:13:45,350 --> 01:13:42,560
have just

2020
01:13:46,950 --> 01:13:45,360
described um where someone either

2021
01:13:47,990 --> 01:13:46,960
reading the book oftentimes watching a

2022
01:13:51,110 --> 01:13:48,000
youtube video too

2023
01:13:52,390 --> 01:13:51,120
or listening to an audio um will have

2024
01:13:57,189 --> 01:13:52,400
these

2025
01:13:59,669 --> 01:13:57,199
researcher named um jeffrey cripel

2026
01:14:00,709 --> 01:13:59,679
oh yes he calls these the the book

2027
01:14:04,149 --> 01:14:00,719
experiences

2028
01:14:06,310 --> 01:14:04,159
and and he's so i don't understand it

2029
01:14:07,110 --> 01:14:06,320
i'm getting so many emails of people

2030
01:14:08,950 --> 01:14:07,120
telling me

2031
01:14:10,390 --> 01:14:08,960
essentially the same story that you just

2032
01:14:12,630 --> 01:14:10,400
told me that was two quarters

2033
01:14:13,430 --> 01:14:12,640
but with an owl hooting out the window

2034
01:14:17,510 --> 01:14:13,440
or

2035
01:14:19,030 --> 01:14:17,520
place even seeing a ufo

2036
01:14:20,870 --> 01:14:19,040
i haven't asked here's a guy this here's

2037
01:14:24,390 --> 01:14:20,880
one story guy

2038
01:14:25,750 --> 01:14:24,400
uh finishes the book

2039
01:14:27,669 --> 01:14:25,760
he's reading it and he's on a break at

2040
01:14:29,030 --> 01:14:27,679
work he's in his car he's coming he just

2041
01:14:31,110 --> 01:14:29,040
reads the last little bit it's on his

2042
01:14:32,229 --> 01:14:31,120
phone right so he reads it on his phone

2043
01:14:34,149 --> 01:14:32,239
reads the last little book of the

2044
01:14:35,270 --> 01:14:34,159
digital thing the last page of of the

2045
01:14:36,550 --> 01:14:35,280
messengers

2046
01:14:38,709 --> 01:14:36,560
and he leaves the car and he walks

2047
01:14:41,750 --> 01:14:38,719
towards work and he says you know

2048
01:14:43,910 --> 01:14:41,760
i wish i want to see an owl

2049
01:14:45,350 --> 01:14:43,920
and he looks up in the sky and there's a

2050
01:14:47,350 --> 01:14:45,360
there's a bright

2051
01:14:48,630 --> 01:14:47,360
light in the sky and he says it was like

2052
01:14:49,990 --> 01:14:48,640
it was like a minus

2053
01:14:52,310 --> 01:14:50,000
sign shaping he said you know what it

2054
01:14:54,790 --> 01:14:52,320
was like it was like someone took

2055
01:14:56,229 --> 01:14:54,800
the fabric of the sky and took a thin

2056
01:14:59,110 --> 01:14:56,239
razor blade and cut

2057
01:15:01,990 --> 01:14:59,120
in and light was peering in through the

2058
01:15:03,590 --> 01:15:02,000
outside of the fabric of the sky

2059
01:15:05,669 --> 01:15:03,600
like peering in at the night from the

2060
01:15:07,189 --> 01:15:05,679
nighttime sky wow

2061
01:15:11,430 --> 01:15:07,199
so yeah so here's the guy reading the

2062
01:15:14,149 --> 01:15:11,440
book asks to see an owl and sees the ufo

2063
01:15:15,750 --> 01:15:14,159
and this was not jeffrey cripel no this

2064
01:15:17,350 --> 01:15:15,760
was not jeffrey krebel but this was this

2065
01:15:17,669 --> 01:15:17,360
is what i would call the book experience

2066
01:15:19,350 --> 01:15:17,679
like

2067
01:15:21,189 --> 01:15:19,360
he calls this the book experience when

2068
01:15:24,229 --> 01:15:21,199
people have these these experiences that

2069
01:15:27,430 --> 01:15:24,239
are related to books

2070
01:15:29,590 --> 01:15:27,440
wow wow that is that is extraordinary

2071
01:15:31,189 --> 01:15:29,600
before we let you go and i think our

2072
01:15:33,669 --> 01:15:31,199
time has basically

2073
01:15:35,270 --> 01:15:33,679
come to an end unfortunately because i

2074
01:15:38,390 --> 01:15:35,280
think i could talk to you for a

2075
01:15:41,750 --> 01:15:38,400
much longer time could you give us

2076
01:15:43,030 --> 01:15:41,760
one final experience that that really

2077
01:15:46,310 --> 01:15:43,040
stands out to you

2078
01:15:49,910 --> 01:15:46,320
from your book or from your

2079
01:15:52,630 --> 01:15:49,920
um files if not in your book

2080
01:15:53,510 --> 01:15:52,640
it could be in here i did a hypnotic

2081
01:15:55,110 --> 01:15:53,520
regression

2082
01:15:57,189 --> 01:15:55,120
i have a funny little anecdote that came

2083
01:16:00,550 --> 01:15:57,199
from the hypnotic regression

2084
01:16:04,390 --> 01:16:00,560
i can talk about that that's a so i

2085
01:16:05,830 --> 01:16:04,400
um i'll so i'll tell you here's i'll

2086
01:16:06,470 --> 01:16:05,840
tell you a couple of very short stories

2087
01:16:09,030 --> 01:16:06,480
a woman

2088
01:16:10,630 --> 01:16:09,040
she's now a grandmother she was driving

2089
01:16:11,510 --> 01:16:10,640
this is not the hypnosis experience i'll

2090
01:16:14,070 --> 01:16:11,520
just fill that in

2091
01:16:15,910 --> 01:16:14,080
so the woman is driving home excuse me

2092
01:16:17,830 --> 01:16:15,920
this woman is a grandmother now

2093
01:16:19,270 --> 01:16:17,840
and when she was a teenager she was

2094
01:16:20,709 --> 01:16:19,280
severely depressed and she was going to

2095
01:16:22,950 --> 01:16:20,719
commit suicide

2096
01:16:24,790 --> 01:16:22,960
and she got in her car and she had a

2097
01:16:26,310 --> 01:16:24,800
spot all picked out in the woods a

2098
01:16:28,550 --> 01:16:26,320
little turn off in the woods

2099
01:16:30,229 --> 01:16:28,560
and she was going to go there to to with

2100
01:16:31,669 --> 01:16:30,239
a hose

2101
01:16:33,669 --> 01:16:31,679
from take from the tailpipe into the car

2102
01:16:35,750 --> 01:16:33,679
and a pillow and she

2103
01:16:37,669 --> 01:16:35,760
driving along and she's approaching the

2104
01:16:38,310 --> 01:16:37,679
turnout and she slows down to turn into

2105
01:16:39,750 --> 01:16:38,320
the turnout

2106
01:16:42,470 --> 01:16:39,760
and an owl flies right up to the

2107
01:16:44,070 --> 01:16:42,480
windshield and she says she locks eyes

2108
01:16:45,750 --> 01:16:44,080
with this owl she said it felt like it

2109
01:16:48,709 --> 01:16:45,760
was there for 15 seconds and then it

2110
01:16:50,870 --> 01:16:48,719
flies off

2111
01:16:52,870 --> 01:16:50,880
and she turned around and came home so

2112
01:16:55,830 --> 01:16:52,880
there's an experience where an owl

2113
01:16:58,229 --> 01:16:55,840
saved her life she recognized the power

2114
01:17:01,430 --> 01:16:58,239
of that experience

2115
01:17:02,070 --> 01:17:01,440
so that's that's a that's a beautiful um

2116
01:17:05,590 --> 01:17:02,080
a beautiful

2117
01:17:09,350 --> 01:17:05,600
story uh saving a life and that is

2118
01:17:11,110 --> 01:17:09,360
um uh just beautiful i don't have

2119
01:17:12,390 --> 01:17:11,120
another word for it just it's just a

2120
01:17:13,990 --> 01:17:12,400
lovely story

2121
01:17:16,070 --> 01:17:14,000
yeah and i have a couple of those that

2122
01:17:19,990 --> 01:17:16,080
play out almost exactly like that

2123
01:17:20,630 --> 01:17:20,000
well so when we look through the cosmic

2124
01:17:22,709 --> 01:17:20,640
window

2125
01:17:25,430 --> 01:17:22,719
or we stick some fingers through that

2126
01:17:28,550 --> 01:17:25,440
thick foggy material and we get to see

2127
01:17:31,350 --> 01:17:28,560
this little glimpse of another reality

2128
01:17:33,430 --> 01:17:31,360
we should all pay attention huh mike

2129
01:17:35,189 --> 01:17:33,440
that is my only that's my that's the one

2130
01:17:36,229 --> 01:17:35,199
thing that synchronicity is just saying

2131
01:17:37,510 --> 01:17:36,239
pay attention

2132
01:17:38,709 --> 01:17:37,520
if you try to read any deeper than that

2133
01:17:39,910 --> 01:17:38,719
you're just going to get lost just pay

2134
01:17:43,510 --> 01:17:39,920
attention yes

2135
01:17:46,070 --> 01:17:43,520
indeed well thank you so very much

2136
01:17:46,630 --> 01:17:46,080
for being our guest and uh we hope to

2137
01:17:50,870 --> 01:17:46,640
hope

2138
01:17:53,990 --> 01:17:50,880
too distant future

2139
01:17:55,030 --> 01:17:54,000
um and uh that's about it i guess from

2140
01:17:57,750 --> 01:17:55,040
shattered reality

2141
01:17:58,950 --> 01:17:57,760
we wish you well this has been a delight

2142
01:18:01,510 --> 01:17:58,960
thank you so much

2143
01:18:02,630 --> 01:18:01,520
oh you're really welcome and uh we'll be

2144
01:18:05,669 --> 01:18:02,640
in touch

2145
01:18:08,550 --> 01:18:05,679
yes take care bye now

2146
01:18:09,189 --> 01:18:08,560
so shattered reality listeners i hope

2147
01:18:12,790 --> 01:18:09,199
you have

2148
01:18:15,910 --> 01:18:12,800
enjoyed um this conversation

2149
01:18:17,510 --> 01:18:15,920
with mike clelland who has written the

2150
01:18:21,310 --> 01:18:17,520
messengers books

2151
01:18:24,070 --> 01:18:21,320
about owls and you will check him out at

2152
01:18:24,950 --> 01:18:24,080
mikecleland.com and from that site

2153
01:18:27,830 --> 01:18:24,960
apparently

2154
01:18:28,310 --> 01:18:27,840
you can get to all of his other sites

2155
01:18:31,669 --> 01:18:28,320
our

2156
01:18:32,790 --> 01:18:31,679
next guest we have pretty much locked in

2157
01:18:36,470 --> 01:18:32,800
so i feel

2158
01:18:38,390 --> 01:18:36,480
somewhat uh okay about announcing him i

2159
01:18:41,430 --> 01:18:38,400
don't like to announce people that

2160
01:18:45,669 --> 01:18:41,440
haven't absolutely checked in with us

2161
01:18:48,790 --> 01:18:45,679
and our next guest is supposed to be

2162
01:18:52,310 --> 01:18:48,800
dr robert moss

2163
01:18:53,270 --> 01:18:52,320
who is a dream researcher and he will be

2164
01:18:56,870 --> 01:18:53,280
with us

2165
01:19:00,070 --> 01:18:56,880
in two weeks from today

2166
01:19:02,709 --> 01:19:00,080
so please if you have any experiences

2167
01:19:05,110 --> 01:19:02,719
with owls or other experiences with

2168
01:19:08,229 --> 01:19:05,120
other animals that seem to be

2169
01:19:09,030 --> 01:19:08,239
paranormal i invite you to get in touch

2170
01:19:11,990 --> 01:19:09,040
with us

2171
01:19:13,669 --> 01:19:12,000
we will be glad to have you in our

2172
01:19:16,709 --> 01:19:13,679
listeners corner

2173
01:19:19,669 --> 01:19:16,719
uh try to like our page

2174
01:19:20,630 --> 01:19:19,679
on facebook shattered reality podcast is

2175
01:19:23,910 --> 01:19:20,640
our page

2176
01:19:29,870 --> 01:19:23,920
just put that in the bar again

2177
01:19:34,310 --> 01:19:30,950
shatteredrealitypodcast.wordpress.com

2178
01:19:39,030 --> 01:19:34,320
and shatteredrealitypodcast.com

2179
01:19:43,350 --> 01:19:39,040
you can find us on the podcasting sites

2180
01:19:45,669 --> 01:19:43,360
such as itunes and stitcher

2181
01:19:46,550 --> 01:19:45,679
and then we have a number of our

2182
01:19:49,590 --> 01:19:46,560
podcasts

2183
01:19:53,030 --> 01:19:49,600
up on youtube so please

2184
01:19:55,910 --> 01:19:53,040
make your comments like us

2185
01:19:57,350 --> 01:19:55,920
like the individual podcasts like our

2186
01:20:01,189 --> 01:19:57,360
whole operation

2187
01:20:05,110 --> 01:20:01,199
we appreciate every single listener